God and Hell.

that was from a south park episode!

Actually, it was only IN a South Park episode. You need to do a search on the flying spaghetti monster, or FSM

Great episode!

I will crack open your skull on my tummy, and eat your brains!

"The loch ness monster exists"
"no it doesn't"
"prove it doesn't exist?"
"can't, sry"
"owned"

"The loch ness monster exists"
"no it doesn't"
"prove it doesn't exist?"
"can't, sry"
"owned"

"The Loch Ness monster exists."
"Prove it."
"Can't, sorry."
"Owned."

EDIT: This is a moot argument :/

If god is all perfect non-evil then how did he create evil.

He didn't. God gave the world "free will". Free will is what created evil, not God.

Lol blizzard "prove he doesn't exist then"

I'm going to jail soon, cause, guilty until proven innocent.

And how do you know he doesn't? Did you go out into the universe looked for God and haven't found him? Just because you can't percept electromagnetic waves, doesn't mean they don't exist. Prove that time exists. You can't prove it, yet it exists.

Or, to put it another way, I could say there's a flying spaghetti monster. You can't prove that it DOESN'T exist, so does that mean it exists?

OMG, I lawl'd so much! xD
No, I never said God does exist, I said there is no proof that he doesn't just like there is no proof that he does. You can't say something doesn't exist if it is beyond our understanding and possibilities to prove. Same works with Nessy there. We are not really in the position to prove its existence.
BTW, a flying spaghetti monster is irrational, it can't exist IN THIS UNIVERSE, because of the laws of physics we have here. That's already proof that it doesn't exist IN THIS UNIVERSE.

I don't think Nessy exists. Why? Do you really think it has survived for 65 million years? Meh. Although I can be wrong.

EDIT: All in all if you can't prove it doesn't exist, it's not wrong to believe in it. It's not your problem, so you don't have to go on other people's nerves because of it. You can argue over belief just like you can argue over opinions: They are all different, but not neccesary wrong.

@JH: Oh, is it harmful if I believe Nessy exists and live on my life even though it doesn't?

Nightwolf, it's still possible to cite just do a Wikipedia search or a Yahoo search or a Dogpile one. Don't bother with google unless you want porn instead.

You cant google God.

EDIT: This is a moot argument :/

You know wat moot is in Hindi?

Prove that time exists. You can't prove it, yet it exists.

No it doesn't.

EDIT:
Prove it and kill us all! :O

Prove that time exists. You can't prove it, yet it exists.

No it doesn't.

Heart Breaker.

<|3

www.bible.com

Tsunokiette - I have nothing against you in fact I think your one of the soundest members on here...

There are a few reasons I don't follow my Christian Faith (I was born into it, but have rejected it)... Reasons:-

1. Why the heck do people go to Church on a Sunday ?, its Gods Day of rest and all his followers do is sing at him and ask him for favors for others ALL DAY !!!... God (if he exists) is more likely to send those buggers to hell rather than the none followers... I mean imagine when they die, there gunna be bugging the arse off God "can have your Autograph"... "Can I be your best mate"... Blah Blah Blah...

2. Why do Christians wear the cross around their necks, that’s what killed their beloved Jesus...? - And if you say, no that’s what freed him and he became the holy ghost... Well Fantastic, but it stopped him using his healing hands and leading by example... I think the fish symbol is a better one as it symbolizes his miracles and is helping nature

3. Why is there so many different versions of the Bible?... Its been played about with to suite the church and peoples effic's so many times, I just can't swallow it...

But... I do think Jesus was a real person, and yeah he may have thought he was the son of God... now I can give you a few reasons why he thought this:-

1. He had a mental problem like Scitsophrenea... he heard voices... and the power of positive thought from those that followed him helped make people feel better... combined mental projection has not been investigated enough, who knows if Jesus and his deciplines all concentrated their thoughts at one thing may be it had X-men like effects...

2. He had some decpiles that had over imaginative minds... no doubt through sleep deprivation, it’s not like the had spring mattress and they had been on the run from Herod for some time...

3. May be Jesus was a Drug dealer, and his Disciples followed him for free hand outs and most of the time tripping their nuts off... and seeing Jesus do wonder-ful things... like feeding the 5,000 with fish and bread... may be he got them to smoke so weed 1st, and they all had the munchies and ate dirt and just so happened to be Hallucinating Jesus handing them Bread when all it was, was Mud... Could explain why Jesus Washed feet, may be he was collecting Fungal Spores to grind up into Acid like tablets...

All 3 of those reasons are just as believable to ME as A Virgin gave birth to the Son of God...

What I think God is... I think he is not a he... but an it... I doubt we can comprehend exactly what God is... But I know if God had any thing to do with what was written in the bible he would have left out many of the Kids stories like the burning bush and the technicoloured dream coat... oh and the worst has got to be Noah and that poxy Arc... What a load of Tosh...

Hell... I don't think there is a Hell... I mean define right from wrong...?

Who's to say what’s right and wrong... We are mammals just like Chimps but they have no rules, they kill each other and think nothing of it... and I bet we would too if it wasn't forced upon us in our up bringing... Take for example, have a child separated at birth and put into intense army training, it will kill without remorse...

I have died once... I saw nothing, I was dead for about 2mins (Approx, it was over 2mins) - me laying on the side of the pool being resuscitated... Have no idea how long I was at the bottom of the pool for... I saw no tunnel of light, or a God of any sort...(I did see a Neon like skipping rope spinning with what looked like a Sweet wrapper in the middle, bright pink neon) I have done many a thing evolving the Occult and not once seen or heard God...

I do however think there are beings walking by us, not of this dimension, I think they have no time barrier... just like Bacteria can't see us, we cant see them... May be once we die and our Energy is released we may be able to see them (Brain Death)...

I don't want to make out I am knocking your religion as I am all for it, if it helps you get through life and keep you on the straight and narrow then fine...

But I think Religion causes too many wars and disputes... Oh and I hate door knocking Jesus lickers... they tick me off...

One of my X-girlfriends was born with Sistic-fibrosis - She died at the age of 22, I used to date her from age 9 till about 15, she was one of my best mates until she died... I miss her and hope what ever awaits in the after life is better than the life she had here, her last few years she felt pain, more so than any she would get in any Hell (if there was one)... If there was a God why would he test some one by giving them such a cruel fait...

I have a Q.

Why does the bible never talk about dinosaurs? So if you say god made the world did he put the massive bones of dinosaurs in the ground to play a trick on us?

So did it happen like this?

-Dinosaurs born
-they die
-god makes Adam and Eeve 

I'm not sure what everyone is saying when they say the Bible doesn't mention dinosaurs. It does.

Behemoth (brachiosaurus)
Job 40:15-24

Leviathan (kronosaurus)
Job chapter 41
Psalm 104:25,26
Isaiah 27:1
bombardier beetle. This beetle is a native of Central America, and has a nozzle in its hind end that acts like a little flame thrower. It sprays a high-temperature jet of gas (fueled by hydroquinones and hydrogen peroxide with oxidative enzymes) for protection

Forgot to answer your question, sorry bought that lol.

God made world (including dinosaurs). God made man. Man kicked out of Eden. God tells Noah to build ark to save his family. Great Flood wipes out all evil men and many animals. (including dinosaurs). Also carves out Grand Canyon. The Flood also explains how the bones got where they are. The large ammounts of sedimentation caused by the flood would pour over the dead bodies, encrusting them and giving the perfect enviroment for fossils in 7 days that would usually take 100's of years.

EDIT : I didn't have time to answer the other posts, now I do.

@LoS - I thank you.
Why do people go to church on Sunday? Because it's easier for them, it's on the weekend and they've already had Saturday to rest. Although technically we should be in prayer constantly. Not actually praying, but realizing God's presence. I myself don't go to church. I don't see a point, worshiping with other believers yeah, but half the time there isn't even 10 real believers. Just people who "got saved" when they walked down the alter at age 6 and go to church all the time; just to leave and live like the rest of the world.
It's spitting on God's face is what it is. I can't help but notice it, it's a part of my nature.

Why do Christians wear the cross around their necks? It's a symbol of what He did for us. It reminds us that He gave His life for us. It's not supposed to be a happy thing, more of a solemn thing. But it is also to remind us that He rose from the dead, defeating death and allowing us to have eternal life.

Why is there so many different versions of the Bible? Simply because not everybody's brains work the same. You can say something to one person, and another will not understand it. People learn different ways. The different versions of the Bible are geared towards different people. For example, I have before me an Extreem Teen Bible(Line of Bibles) New Century Version. The New Century Version is geared for people of our century.

As for your girlfriend. I can't help but console you on that. I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, it is a cruel fate. But it's not God's fault. Diseases and such showed up after the fall of man. Where we turned from God and He cursed the world. As much as it seems negative, it's more the fault of everyone around her. God gave the Great Commission for a reason, so stuff like this wouldn't happen. I myself am having troubles, most of my family is athiest, or does the "I'm a good person" approach. (Refering to earlier post on church members)

@Silverline - We're not guilty until proven innocent. We're born with the nature to sin, that's what the Bible means when it says we are born with sin. We're innocent until we ARE guilty. Once we've sinned, no trial needs to be conducted. God saw it, we can try to run but we're denying the innevitable.

@Flying Spaghetti Monster - I doubt you exist, but kudos on hiding if you do. I have no physical evidence either way, so I can't say you do or don't exist. *point*

@Anyone I missed - Please restate your points. There's no way I'm going to be able to sort through all this lol.

EDIT 2:

have some questions...

I god created the universe and everything init, who created god?

So many people claim that rock is the devils work?
then why is there christian rock bands?

How come when people are sick people pray and ask god for them to get better, and then the person dies and the people then go on to say that its what god wanted?
They go on acting like nothng happned but God ignores there prayers? WTF?

I dont mean to be disrespecting people. I mean Im the deputy head boy of a christian school so its not like Im being prejudice they are just questions that have always plauged me and it seems tsuno is answering godly questions so i thought i would ask

So many people claim rock to be the Devil's work because they're being projudice. They're refering to music that uses coarse language and sexual references. As well as songs that actually worship the Devil. (There's some out there) But it's stupid to generalize.

Sick people dying? We look at short term. God looks at long term. What God does we may not understand, but we know that it is for the best, and it may not be in the immediate future, maybe not even our lifetimes.

I also remember a post on poop. Erm, roflz. Sorry, that was funny. The Bible doesn't say going to the bathroom is filthy or sinful. It's removing waste from your body. God gave you that function. If someone says it's sinful, once again, they're being stupid/and or taking liberties.

Leviathan is not supposed to be a dinosaur, it is supposed to be a demon. Christian myth states him as being the one to seduce Adam and Eve. In demonology, he is also considered to be "Grand Admiral", whatever that means.

Likewise, the Behemoth would be a demon, otherwise just a close relative to the ox.

Hence the argument will now involve demonology, as I'm sure some of you will say that doesn't make it true in the world of Christianity. That would be false, demonology, angelology, and Christianity all go hand in hand.

The bible refers to them as creatures. Not demons. It doesn't refer to them in a negative way, in actuality it refers to them in a neutral way.

Besides, if they were demons, wouldn't they be, a little more, angelic looking?

Literally, Angels and Demons are the same thing, they serve different masters however.

The Christian interpretation of Leviathan is often considered to be a demon or natural monster associated with Satan or the Devil, and held by some to be the same monster as Rahab (Isaiah 51:9).

Some biblical scholars considered Leviathan to represent the pre-existent forces of chaos. In Psalm 74:13-14 it says "it was You who drove back the sea with Your might, who smashed the heads of the monsters in the waters; it was You who crushed the heads of Leviathan, who left him as food for the creatures of the wilderness. (JPS edition)" God drove back the waters of the Earth (Genesis 1:2 "And the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters." ([NAS])
Picture of Leviathan often found in grimoires, by an unknown artist.
Enlarge
Picture of Leviathan often found in grimoires, by an unknown artist.

Some interpreters suggest that Leviathan is a symbol of mankind in opposition to God, claiming that it and beasts mentioned in the books of Daniel and Revelation should be interpreted as metaphors. The usage of Leviathan in the Old Testament books (Isaiah 27:1) would seem to be a reference to a Semitic mythological beast mentioned in Ugaritic literature (of Ugarit, a city-state in North Syria). According to Canaanite myth, the Leviathan was an enemy of order in Creation and was slain by the Canaanite god Baal. The word Leviathan to the ancient Jews became synonymous with that which warred against God's kingdom. This especially included nations warring against Israel such as Assyria and Egypt. (The Bible Knowledge Commentary, Old Testament,1985, SP Publications Inc.)

Leviathan also appears in the Apocryphal Book of Enoch, giving the following description of this monster's origins there mentioned as being female, as opposed to the male Behemoth:

    And that day will two monsters be parted, one monster, a female named Leviathan in order to dwell in the abyss of the ocean over the fountains of water; and (the other), a male called Behemoth, which holds his chest in an invisible desert whose name is Dundayin, east of the garden of Eden. - 1 Enoch 60:7-8

Leviathan is also sometimes said to have been of the order of Seraphim. According to the writings of Father Sebastien Michaelis, Balberith, a demon who allegedly possessed Sister Madeleine at Aix-en-Provence, obligingly told the priest not only the other devils possessing the nun, but added the special saints whose function was to oppose them. Leviathan was one devil that was named and was said to tempt men into committing sacrilege. Its adversary was said to be St. Peter.

According to St. Thomas Aquinas, Leviathan is the demon of envy and the demon who is first in punishing the corresponding sinners. Some medieval authors, such as Collin de Plancy and Johann Weyer, considered Leviathan to be Grand Admiral of the maritime regions of Hell.

Oh, wiki has Leviathan as Grand Admiral too, didn't see that before.

Wikipedia seems to be leaning towards demon, but Leviathan has been interpreted to be just an animal, which I believe is also elsewhere on the page. Yet if it were, it's assumed to be a serpent or crocodile. Dinosaur? Maybe, but for the purposes of this discussion, I'd say no.

And demons/angels are considered to look very natural, like an ordinary human or animal, yet even still you'd be able to tell they were more than that right away. Also demons, even when taking the form of human or animal, cannot do so completely. It's said that God's law forces them to show in some way they're inhuman. So, part of their body is always "demonic looking".

Arguement -
Angels can't breath fire.
Therefore Demons can't breath fire.

lol
My friend wrote a book were the angels breath fire...

oh, and in the part were it talks about the leviathan is long with scales, like a snake...  CLICKS HERE NOW!!!


Edit (by mullet)-
On teh subject of the entire bible, if a culture were to develop completely seperate from all other religions, it would develop it's own religion. This is not only based on its culture, i.e. traditions, punishments, but also on the way they wished to perceive the afterlife. All cultures develop a religion, founded around the afterlife, because the idea of the spark of life, being gone forever and thus so cruelly stealing our loved ones from us, is to much to bear. Obviously, when no-one ever comes back, relying on blind faith instead of reason, they would create an afterlife. The idea is that they don't want their loved ones to be gone. So they invent a place for them to go, so that they can be seen later. Like a kennel, or a lost and found.

lol
My friend wrote a book were the angels breath fire...

oh, and in the part were it talks about the leviathan is long with scales, like a snake...  CLICKS HERE NOW!!!

Also it says God banished it to the sea...

ROFLZZZ!!! WOULDN'T IT BE HILLARIOUS IF THAT WAS REFERING TO TEH LOCK NESS MONSTER!?!?

I just made that connection lolz.

Oh, and angels/demons can't breathe fire. They can summon it (angels from Heaven, demons from Hell *obviously*), but they can't breath it.

In the late fifth century BC...

The Bible was started to be written 1000 B.C. Also The hebrew folk didn't have any contact even quite some time after the late 5th century B.C..

So you are dmitting that the Old Testament was the product of isolated desert savages? That if they had contact with other, more intelligent cultures, they wouldn't have had this mythology?

God is not science.

Of course.

People wanted to know how everything was created, so the invented science. SCIENCE is the thing that is supposed to explain the Genesis, not God.

Weasel word! Genesis is already an explanation of the origin of the universe and is decidedly unscientific. Science does not exist to explain the Bible.

Also I said so even the most stupid human could understand it. Find one person with an IQ of 50 or lower and explain him what an atom is. Now explain him tell him there is a God who created everything. What do you think how he will react?

People with an IQ of 50 are retarded. So: is the Bible written for retarded people? If so, why are the metaphors sometimes incomprehensible. Also, what do you have to say about people who believe that the Bible is 100% factual? What about the people who believe that the Bible is partially factual?

how many people believe that? And what was the metaphor behind, say, Noah's Ark?

I don't know what Metophor is behind Noah's Ark, how could I? Didn't I say, I haven't read the Bible?!

Read it and get back to me.

The Bible says that fruit bearing plants were created before fish. If this is a metaphor, it is an inaccurate one.

[sarcasm]Oh, in the Bible is exactly written how plants slowly turned into fish? I didn't know that.[/sarcasm] If you didn't know, fish also breathe. Plants were first on earth, they created O₂ out of C0₂, the water absorbed some of it due to diffusion. AFTER these events, fish had something to breathe and could start to evolve.

Obviously you know nothing about evolutionary history. Plants were not "first" on Earth, they were contemporaneous with primitive animals (as well as the other kingdoms). Fruit are the products of flowering plants, which are the products of land plants. Flowering plants first made an appearance during the Cretaceous. Dinosaurs and mammals are not older than fish.

Yeah, that's not what you're doing at all!

And what exactly have I said different than just the entire Christianity?

You say that the Bible is entirely metaphorical. How many hundreds of millions believe otherwise?

Why?

You've already had Physic classes? If yes, you should be able to recall this here. I mean this part:

Energy is a conserved quantity, meaning that it cannot be created or destroyed, but only converted from one form into another. Thus, the total energy of the universe always remains constant.

So if it can't be created or destroyed, there has to be an origin as the universe wasn't existant for eternity, it is about 13.7 billion years old. Again, check wiki if you don't believe me.

Stop trying to make God into a personification of natural forces.

Believing in something that isn't real is harmful.

Prove that he doesn't exist then.

There is no evidence that he does, and science seems to get along fine without having to account for the divine.

It's incredible how Jesus' words were universal. You can take any time, any situation, any possible possiblity and if you listen to what he said, you will realize "Yes... that actually is right."

Erm, you have quoted that part, but there's nothing below it... >.<

Maybe you just don't want to see it.

11 So he said to them, "Whoever  divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. 12 And if a woman divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery."

But it is a false hope.

Again, I tell you prove that it's false.

Prove that there isn't a teapot orbiting Vega right now. You can't? It must be there, then.

And how do you know he doesn't? Did you go out into the universe looked for God and haven't found him? Just because you can't percept electromagnetic waves, doesn't mean they don't exist.

Buy we can perceive EM waves. Where are the instruments that measure God?

Prove that time exists. You can't prove it, yet it exists.

We can observe the passage of events. I have not yet observed God.

No, I never said God does exist, I said there is no proof that he doesn't just like there is no proof that he does. You can't say something doesn't exist if it is beyond our understanding and possibilities to prove. Same works with Nessy there. We are not really in the position to prove its existence.

The fact that the workings of the universe operate exactly the same without a divine hand is proof.

BTW, a flying spaghetti monster is irrational, it can't exist IN THIS UNIVERSE, because of the laws of physics we have here. That's already proof that it doesn't exist IN THIS UNIVERSE.

So why can God?

I don't think Nessy exists. Why? Do you really think it has survived for 65 million years? Meh. Although I can be wrong.

If there was a large enough population to sustain a plesiosaur population for millions of years then they would be surfacing all the time and carcasses would wash up on the shore regularly.

EDIT: All in all if you can't prove it doesn't exist, it's not wrong to believe in it. It's not your problem, so you don't have to go on other people's nerves because of it.

It is our problem because society is worse off when burdened with magical thinking.

@JH: Oh, is it harmful if I believe Nessy exists and live on my life even though it doesn't?

Nobody who believes that the Lock Ness Monster exists thinks that it tells them how to live their lives.

There are a few reasons I don't follow my Christian Faith (I was born into it, but have rejected it)...

Nobody is born a Christian.

Reasons:-

1. Why the heck do people go to Church on a Sunday ?

2. Why do Christians wear the cross around their necks, that’s what killed their beloved Jesus...?

3. Why is there so many different versions of the Bible?...

These questions are easily answered and if that was all it took to abandon Christianity then your faith wasn't very strong in the first place.

But... I do think Jesus was a real person,

Why?

and yeah he may have thought he was the son of God... now I can give you a few reasons why he thought this:-

1. He had a mental problem like Scitsophrenea... he heard voices... and the power of positive thought from those that followed him helped make people feel better... combined mental projection has not been investigated enough, who knows if Jesus and his deciplines all concentrated their thoughts at one thing may be it had X-men like effects...

FUCK.

2. He had some decpiles that had over imaginative minds... no doubt through sleep deprivation, it’s not like the had spring mattress and they had been on the run from Herod for some time...

FUCK.

3. May be Jesus was a Drug dealer, and his Disciples followed him for free hand outs and most of the time tripping their nuts off... and seeing Jesus do wonder-ful things... like feeding the 5,000 with fish and bread... may be he got them to smoke so weed 1st, and they all had the munchies and ate dirt and just so happened to be Hallucinating Jesus handing them Bread when all it was, was Mud... Could explain why Jesus Washed feet, may be he was collecting Fungal Spores to grind up into Acid like tablets...

FUCK.

I do however think there are beings walking by us, not of this dimension, I think they have no time barrier... just like Bacteria can't see us, we cant see them... May be once we die and our Energy is released we may be able to see them (Brain Death)...

FUCK.

dinosaurs and fossils

Let me link you to the appropriate TalkOrigins page.

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC361.html
http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CH/CH581.html

Arguement -
Angels can't breath fire.
Therefore Demons can't breath fire.

Is this directed at me? Because if it is, I don't know what it means, I never mentioned anything about breathing fire.

@Blizzard: Saying the spaghetti monster can't exist because of our laws of physics doesn't support that God exists; By our laws of physics, God is irrational and therefore cannot be, because of the claim that he is all-powerful, he can do whatever he wants, physics wouldn't apply to Him. So, laws of physics here doesn't mean anything, and is completely irrelevant to the point I was making (which is clear many of you have never heard of the flying spaghetti monster rebuttal), yet Jesus Hitler and others here have made similar points as me, so we'll see what is said about those...

1. He had a mental problem like Scitsophrenea... he heard voices... and the power of positive thought from those that followed him helped make people feel better... combined mental projection has not been investigated enough, who knows if Jesus and his deciplines all concentrated their thoughts at one thing may be it had X-men like effects...

Hey Jesus Hitler, according to ladofshadows I have awesome powers... 

Hmm I just realised that Jesus Hitler is the only one here who will know what I mean by that.

Life's pleasures and pain is nothing compared to the pleasures or the pain that awaits you after death. Choose you way: Cause pain now and feel pain after death or cause pleasure now and feel pleasure after death. You will get what you earn yourself.

@Fu: Lol, you're nuts! :O

@Halo: Just like you said, he doesn't apply to our physics. That's why he is all-powerful. He isn't limited like we are. And that spaghetti monster might exist, I can't prove it doesn't, even tough it's actually irrational, but meh.

@Tsuno: God created the very beginning (call it Big Bang if you will). Everything else eles that followed was just like God wanted it and has foreseen it. Most probably everything around us is already destinied, but it is on us to fullfil it, because we are the ones who have free will.

@JH:

People with an IQ of 50 are retarded. So: is the Bible written for retarded people? If so, why are the metaphors sometimes incomprehensible. Also, what do you have to say about people who believe that the Bible is 100% factual? What about the people who believe that the Bible is partially factual?

Stop twisting my words for the second time, I have said EVEN the most stupid human. That means the Bible is written for ANYBODY.

So you are dmitting that the Old Testament was the product of isolated desert savages? That if they had contact with other, more intelligent cultures, they wouldn't have had this mythology?

You should really listen to yourself... Greek mythology had its roots inside a civilised community, yet today nobody believes in Zeus or Olympia or anything like that. So which religion has survived? Desert savages or sophisticated and civilised mythology? Think about that a little bit.

Obviously you know nothing about evolutionary history. Plants were not "first" on Earth, they were contemporaneous with primitive animals (as well as the other kingdoms). Fruit are the products of flowering plants, which are the products of land plants. Flowering plants first made an appearance during the Cretaceous. Dinosaurs and mammals are not older than fish.

Yes, animals were there before land plants. But plants were the very first.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_evolution
Click on Photosyntesis (note, it's before animals) and tell me what algea is. Or just don't, I know it already.

Dinosaurs and mammals are not older than fish.

?_? I never said that. It's obvious that dinosaurs evolved out of fish (in a long shot of course...)

You say that the Bible is entirely metaphorical. How many hundreds of millions believe otherwise?

It wasn't always this way. In the times we have today, we know it's not entirely metaphorical and also only the Old Testament mainly is.

Maybe you just don't want to see it.

Sorry, I wasn't sure what you meant with that, so I didn't want to interprete it wrong.

11 So he said to them, "Whoever  divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. 12 And if a woman divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery."

Yes, marrying another wife while your first wife is still alive is a big sin. Doesn't it say "Until death divorces us."? What do you think that comes from? Something like this should be in the Bible: "Marriage is a holy bound between a man and a woman."

Stop trying to make God into a personification of natural forces.

Haha, natural forces! Since when is pure energy a natural force? So light is a natural force, yeah? And heat also? Check wiki what light and heat actually are, I'm too lazy to get you the links. Obviously yes, you didn't have any advanced physics classes.

There is no evidence that he does, and science seems to get along fine without having to account for the divine.

Problem solved.

Prove that there isn't a teapot orbiting Vega right now. You can't? It must be there, then.

Prove that there is. What do you think people mean be "undetermined"? It means it can't be proved that it's wrong, neither it can't be proved that it's right. If there actually IS a God is undetermined. That's why it's called belief. There is no proof that there isn't. In other words you believe that there is a teapot orbiting Vega right now. Alright, fine with me, my DC-factor on this sentence is 9.9.

Buy we can perceive EM waves. Where are the instruments that measure God?

No, you can't. Perceive (sorry for percept, English is just my third language...) is different from measuring. Can you feel EM waves? Can you see them? Can you taste them? Again I say measuring is not the same as perceiving.
Example:
You perceive it's colder inside than outside. How many degrees? Well, you can't tell me except you measure it and compare the two temparatures.

We can observe the passage of events.

Interesting conclusion... But I would rather say we see its effects, because time is quantized (that means there IS a smallest measure of time, a so-called frame) and inside one frame there is no change, so you can't observe time inside one frame, therefore you can't observe time, only it's effects.

I have not yet observed God.

[sarcasm]Christianity is just a folklore, it doesn't really exist, you know. And Jesus is not real. Just like all the churches around the world.[/sarcasm] I have observed the effects that God has on the people. Did you? Maybe I should leave this part out, because I am not trying to convince you that God exists as analogy to the existance of time (or maybe even time doesn't exist ?_? ). You can ignore this here if you want to.

The fact that the workings of the universe operate exactly the same without a divine hand is proof.

Read the first part I told Tsuno.

So why can God?

I didn't say he exists inside the universe. You should be able to find that from my post you have quoted there.

If there was a large enough population to sustain a plesiosaur population for millions of years then they would be surfacing all the time and carcasses would wash up on the shore regularly.

Sure. Just like I said, I doubt it. Yet I can't prove it and... well, that's it. I live my life on.

Nobody who believes that the Lock Ness Monster exists thinks that it tells them how to live their lives.

Nobody tells you how to live your life. Forgot what free will is?

Read it and get back to me.

Lol, I don't care what you think or if you believe me. It's you choice to believe or not, nobody can enforce you his belief, neither I am trying here. But you should do the same. I'm not trying to get you believe in God, I only try to explain why I do believe in God.



I think I will stop posting here... -_- It takes mre more than half an hour to put such a post together... Although I feel good to have some intellectual challenge here.

11 So he said to them, "Whoever  divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. 12 And if a woman divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery."

Yes, marrying another wife while your first wife is still alive is a big sin. Doesn't it say "Until death divorces us."? What do you think that comes from? Something like this should be in the Bible: "Marriage is a holy bound between a man and a woman.

So it would be better to kill your wife first?

That's even more of a sin. But technically yes: If you kill her you don't sin if you marry another woman. BUT YOU HAVE KILLED HER! THAT'S WORSE!
Lol, you should have seen my face when I found out marrying another woman if your first one is still alive is a sin. :O I was like "WTF?!"