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Silver Heart [VXA][Demo]

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Silver Heart


Story

This is the story of a metaphysical being known as a Sage and his time on the world, and a journey with a group of Humans to stop a man who threatens their existence with his new found powers that rival and threaten to surpass those of the Sages.



Screenshots & Videos

Spoiler for:




Short video demonstrating the battle system and menu in use.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18nrF-I2gR0



Credits

TDS - Overall development.
Neena - Pixel Art.



Demo

Without RTP
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/Silver%20Heart.exe

With RTP
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/RTP%20Silver%20Heart.exe

Notes about this demo:
  • You can press F5 to change the size of the screen back to normal.
  • The duration of the demo is about 5~10 depending on how many battles are fought.
  • I am far from a good writer, so I don't personally think I can improve on the story a whole lot. The story is mostly there to allow me to add more enemies and mechanics. If there are good suggestions for the story I see no problem implementing them though.
  • There is no title screen and no way to load your save files at the moment. This is intentional for the testing of this demo.
  • To skip event cutscenes press the "CTRL" key and it will bring up a prompt allowing you to skip it.
  • You are not going to win all battles, odds are pretty high that if you don't learn when to leave you're just going to die. After battles whether you win or escape you "Rest" which gives you back some HP, use this to your advantage to conserve your items.

For anyone who plays the demo, please let me know what if anything came off as too confusing in the gameplay mechanics such as the ones in the battle system. Also if you died your first time playing it (Not important, but I'm keeping track of that.).
« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 01:43:58 AM by TDS »

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I watched the video. The menu looks really cool in the way it is organized, and the battle system looks fun and unique. Could you maybe include a demo that has the RTP? I cannot play the game without it, as I don't have VXA.

I support:



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Damn TDS that battlesystem looks incredible, it reminds me of HalfMinuteHero :P, trying the demo out now

EDIT: I love it, but the battles seem to take too long, maybe i'm just impatient XD
« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 01:50:29 AM by IAMFORTE »

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I watched the video. The menu looks really cool in the way it is organized, and the battle system looks fun and unique. Could you maybe include a demo that has the RTP? I cannot play the game without it, as I don't have VXA.

Thanks, also I added a demo with the RTP included.

Damn TDS that battlesystem looks incredible, it reminds me of HalfMinuteHero :P, trying the demo out now

Thanks, Half Minute Hero was the inspiration for the battle system. Let me know what you think of it when you try the demo.

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This looks pretty cool TDS. Downloading now~

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Love the concept and video! Will download soon!

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The word Sage made me think of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (but only since I'm playing it on my 3DS for some time now) but then I read on and I was like "Oh, like that?"...
So that's nothing to worry about.

The fourth character in you screenshot however, immediately made me think of Final Fantasy XII, though he doesn't look like it. Nothing to worry about there either but I'd add a slight change in his name if that were possible (something like Vaen or Vahn) so that phonetically they still sound like it... That's still your choice though :yuyu:

As for the rest I've seen in your topic.
I'd like to have some more background info (The history of the world, what time period it is, what happened before, who the other guys are, how the sage met them, ...) anything that is irrelevant or slightly relevant to the story inside the game but which makes it even more fun to play it. It's not necessary but it might be a good improvement, I like what you had so far as it made me want to comment on it  :drsword:
Your characters should be explained. How old is the sage, what race, is he friendly or a pain in the ass, how about the others, what are they like, what is their story, ...? Just some things to help you on improving your writing as you say you're no good at it :ladyj:


It really looks good and it piqued my interest for sure!
I will try the demo as soon as I have some time to do it  :aco:

« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 09:59:23 AM by Amycha19 »


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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Spoiler for supporting!:


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Random note: there's this strange thing I've noticed that I seem to end up writing a lot of text. So I apologise in advance. I've split it up with spoilers so it doesn't look as bad.

@Amycha
Spoiler for Needing to know more:
I don't think it's really too important to give people a complete picture of the whole story, of all the characters involved and their specifics.

The outline tells us everything we need to know to get going: It's a typical story about a bad guy who is growing in power and threatens the existence of at least the human race, but perhaps even the world itself, and some good guys led by what I assume is a powerful being himself, the Sage, are attempting to stop him.

Also, the Sage is a metaphysical being and is thus, by definition, an abstract being. He doesn't need to have a race, or an age, or even an allegiance. I think its quite natural these days to want to focus on the dressing of a game, rather than the game itself. You will (hopefully, I'm a story/lore person myself) come across those details by playing the game, not by reading about it. You don't read the blurb of a book and learn about the whole thing just from that.

The description that TDS has given has obviously served its purpose: you're interest is piqued and you are already asking questions about the details. Well, when the game comes out we can find those answers. Knowing now, might just spoil that part.

On topic:

Spoiler for Game thoughts:
I remember seeing the showcase demo of the battle system from a while back. I still can't say that I find it too interesting personally. I always prefer more interactivity with my games, and outside of using items it's pretty autonomous. It is a nice thing that I don't have to go about spamming my confirm key.

I played out through the demo. I went outside and quickly understood the mini-map like thing. Two Rafflesia popped up and proceeded to whoop my ass rather quickly. So, +1 death very early on.

I have a question though. I noticed that that long yellow? bar that depletes and then regenerates is how long you have in Rush Mode? What exactly is that? To me, it just appears to be a time limited battle speed up. Does it do anything else, or have I missed what it actually is anyway? Reason I ask is that I'm not really a fan of it if it's a simple time limited battle speed up mechanic, because it doesn't really add anything. With the battle system being as un-interactive as it is, I'd quite like a "get it over with" button to rush things along. Like any repetitive random battle system, it quickly gets dull and becomes an annoyance rather than an obstacle.

Spoiler for Discussion point: Escape as a strategy in random battles:

You are not going to win all battles, odds are pretty high that if you don't learn when to leave you're just going to die. After battles whether you win or escape you "Rest" which gives you back some HP, use this to your advantage to conserve your items.


I can see that this is a part of the strategy that's involved in surviving an encounter. And even though I read this part before I played the demo, it never actually crossed my mind to do so. In any RPG that's I've ever played, running away from a fight has never been an option unless forced. To me, a battle is a challenge that you are trying to beat and overcome and I try my best not to give up. This is what used to frustrate me in those old FF classic games that led you to a dungeon where enemies would just destroy you with no warning. Running away should be an option, not a necessity. And sometimes it can be a strategy, but its one that is best suited to tactical/strategy games rather than random battle orientated RPGs/games in general.

I do appreciate the strategy of escaping ("Live to fight another day" kind of thing). But in a game where the expectation on the player is to not have to run away, it would be at least an idea to tell players that the option exists and is a wise thing to keep in mind. There doesn't need to be a reward for it, because running away from a challenge should not be rewarding, but it should remind people that "Perhaps you need a bit more knowledge, or another approach, to overcoming this one". But, again, random battle games don't really favour the process of overcoming challenges. That's best left to boss fights and end game ventures. Whenever you came across a boss in an RPG and was unable to defeat them, you would level up and then try again. It's not as interesting as trying to teach re-evaluation and lateral thinking, but does have a similar essence underneath it.

The better games had some good mechanics involved, like FF7's materia system, that allowed you to try out different set-ups and approaches. I can see this game also having that element when you've got more party members and abilities, though I do worry that the pace of the battle system, and the lack of real interaction, will prevent a lot of players from being able to really analyse where they might be going wrong and figure out where to make changes.

Those are my thoughts on it. It will be interesting to see how it pans out.
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I'm just going to clarify myself here as you seem to, in my eyes, not get where I'm going.

Quote from: LoganF
Spoiler for First off:
I don't think it's really too important to give people a complete picture of the whole story, of all the characters involved and their specifics.

The outline tells us everything we need to know to get going: It's a typical story about a bad guy who is growing in power and threatens the existence of at least the human race, but perhaps even the world itself, and some good guys led by what I assume is a powerful being himself, the Sage, are attempting to stop him.
Spoiler for Secondly:
Also, the Sage is a metaphysical being and is thus, by definition, an abstract being. He doesn't need to have a race, or an age, or even an allegiance.
Spoiler for Last:
The description that TDS has given has obviously served its purpose: you're interest is piqued and you are already asking questions about the details. Well, when the game comes out we can find those answers. Knowing now, might just spoil that part.
Spoiler for First off:
I was not asking for any in-game story.
I was asking for what came BEFORE, being: Why is the man growing in power, what drives him? Why did this Sage, as being a metaphysical being, come down to earth in the first place? Has there ever, before, an event like this taken place? What is/was the world like? Who are the sages actually?
If this is also addressed inside the game, then I get why he did not reveal. Else, I'd like to know. It gives me the feeling of being inside the story from the very beginning instead of getting into the story and knowing what has happened only at the end of the game.

You can't just start a book as of this: Oh, a bad guy has popped up! I'm going to kill him.
That would be one boring book! You NEED background information you else-wise can't get.
Spoiler for Secondly:
As I said in the previous spoiler. You need background information.
I don't say that the sage should have an age or a race, but it would surely be nice to know what kind of person he is (kind-hearted, trouble-minded, cold-hearted, ...). Also the others characters might have an age and a race and whatever more. Maybe 'Blood' is just a nickname for a guy who loves to kill, or it's his real name and he's a gentle do-gooder. For all I know he's just a shy little kid whose parents thought it would be fun to name him Blood? Or perhaps there's some background story to them that we will never learn about.
I would want to know a little, tiny, itty bit about my characters before I'd play, just so that I can visualise how they must feel or think in certain situations.
Spoiler for Last:
I'm not asking for details, I'm asking for Background information. But yes, it piqued my interest. Though, it's not the story that did, I'd say the name did.

I'm a reader, let's clear that out. When I buy a book, I pick one from the shelves that has an interesting name. Then I start reading the back and if that makes me wonder if I should buy it or not, I read the prologue (if there is one). Same with games. I take a game which name makes me feel that it's interesting and then I start reading the back. Most games I check out here tell me a something about the history of the world, the name of the world, characters descriptions, ...
Want to know what happens next? When I completely read the book, I let it sit on the shelve for when I want to read it again and then I read it again, even when I still remember the story! It makes it double the fun...


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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Spoiler for supporting!:


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I'm just going to clarify myself here as you seem to, in my eyes, not get where I'm going.

Quote from: LoganF
Spoiler for First off:
I don't think it's really too important to give people a complete picture of the whole story, of all the characters involved and their specifics.

The outline tells us everything we need to know to get going: It's a typical story about a bad guy who is growing in power and threatens the existence of at least the human race, but perhaps even the world itself, and some good guys led by what I assume is a powerful being himself, the Sage, are attempting to stop him.
Spoiler for Secondly:
Also, the Sage is a metaphysical being and is thus, by definition, an abstract being. He doesn't need to have a race, or an age, or even an allegiance.
Spoiler for Last:
The description that TDS has given has obviously served its purpose: you're interest is piqued and you are already asking questions about the details. Well, when the game comes out we can find those answers. Knowing now, might just spoil that part.
Spoiler for First off:
I was not asking for any in-game story.
I was asking for what came BEFORE, being: Why is the man growing in power, what drives him? Why did this Sage, as being a metaphysical being, come down to earth in the first place? Has there ever, before, an event like this taken place? What is/was the world like? Who are the sages actually?
If this is also addressed inside the game, then I get why he did not reveal. Else, I'd like to know. It gives me the feeling of being inside the story from the very beginning instead of getting into the story and knowing what has happened only at the end of the game.

You can't just start a book as of this: Oh, a bad guy has popped up! I'm going to kill him.
That would be one boring book! You NEED background information you else-wise can't get.
Spoiler for Secondly:
As I said in the previous spoiler. You need background information.
I don't say that the sage should have an age or a race, but it would surely be nice to know what kind of person he is (kind-hearted, trouble-minded, cold-hearted, ...). Also the others characters might have an age and a race and whatever more. Maybe 'Blood' is just a nickname for a guy who loves to kill, or it's his real name and he's a gentle do-gooder. For all I know he's just a shy little kid whose parents thought it would be fun to name him Blood? Or perhaps there's some background story to them that we will never learn about.
I would want to know a little, tiny, itty bit about my characters before I'd play, just so that I can visualise how they must feel or think in certain situations.
Spoiler for Last:
I'm not asking for details, I'm asking for Background information. But yes, it piqued my interest. Though, it's not the story that did, I'd say the name did.

I'm a reader, let's clear that out. When I buy a book, I pick one from the shelves that has an interesting name. Then I start reading the back and if that makes me wonder if I should buy it or not, I read the prologue (if there is one). Same with games. I take a game which name makes me feel that it's interesting and then I start reading the back. Most games I check out here tell me a something about the history of the world, the name of the world, characters descriptions, ...
Want to know what happens next? When I completely read the book, I let it sit on the shelve for when I want to read it again and then I read it again, even when I still remember the story! It makes it double the fun...

Honestly, when I see a game with five pages of backstory in the description before I've even downloaded the game, I'm far less likely to play it. You should experience the story and learn the history of the setting in the game, not in a text-dump of a post. Knowing all this "background information" first could very well spoil a bit of the game, as LoganF mentioned. There's absolutely no need for it; you're supposed to show, not tell. Going into these details in-game is a great way to show; cluttering up a post designed to draw interest for the game with that is merely telling, and that's boring.

That said, I downloaded this demo and I liked it quite a bit (though I did die during my first battle)! The beginning cutscene is a bit long, but since you can skip cutscenes it really isn't an issue. The writing could use some polish, yes, but this game is far more about the mechanics, which are quite exciting (I loved the feel of Half Minute Hero).

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Spoiler for All this stuff here:

I'm just going to clarify myself here as you seem to, in my eyes, not get where I'm going.

Quote from: LoganF
Spoiler for First off:
I don't think it's really too important to give people a complete picture of the whole story, of all the characters involved and their specifics.

The outline tells us everything we need to know to get going: It's a typical story about a bad guy who is growing in power and threatens the existence of at least the human race, but perhaps even the world itself, and some good guys led by what I assume is a powerful being himself, the Sage, are attempting to stop him.
Spoiler for Secondly:
Also, the Sage is a metaphysical being and is thus, by definition, an abstract being. He doesn't need to have a race, or an age, or even an allegiance.
Spoiler for Last:
The description that TDS has given has obviously served its purpose: you're interest is piqued and you are already asking questions about the details. Well, when the game comes out we can find those answers. Knowing now, might just spoil that part.
Spoiler for First off:
I was not asking for any in-game story.
I was asking for what came BEFORE, being: Why is the man growing in power, what drives him? Why did this Sage, as being a metaphysical being, come down to earth in the first place? Has there ever, before, an event like this taken place? What is/was the world like? Who are the sages actually?
If this is also addressed inside the game, then I get why he did not reveal. Else, I'd like to know. It gives me the feeling of being inside the story from the very beginning instead of getting into the story and knowing what has happened only at the end of the game.

You can't just start a book as of this: Oh, a bad guy has popped up! I'm going to kill him.
That would be one boring book! You NEED background information you else-wise can't get.
Spoiler for Secondly:
As I said in the previous spoiler. You need background information.
I don't say that the sage should have an age or a race, but it would surely be nice to know what kind of person he is (kind-hearted, trouble-minded, cold-hearted, ...). Also the others characters might have an age and a race and whatever more. Maybe 'Blood' is just a nickname for a guy who loves to kill, or it's his real name and he's a gentle do-gooder. For all I know he's just a shy little kid whose parents thought it would be fun to name him Blood? Or perhaps there's some background story to them that we will never learn about.
I would want to know a little, tiny, itty bit about my characters before I'd play, just so that I can visualise how they must feel or think in certain situations.
Spoiler for Last:
I'm not asking for details, I'm asking for Background information. But yes, it piqued my interest. Though, it's not the story that did, I'd say the name did.

I'm a reader, let's clear that out. When I buy a book, I pick one from the shelves that has an interesting name. Then I start reading the back and if that makes me wonder if I should buy it or not, I read the prologue (if there is one). Same with games. I take a game which name makes me feel that it's interesting and then I start reading the back. Most games I check out here tell me a something about the history of the world, the name of the world, characters descriptions, ...
Want to know what happens next? When I completely read the book, I let it sit on the shelve for when I want to read it again and then I read it again, even when I still remember the story! It makes it double the fun...


I don't want to bring a discussion about this into TDS' project thread because it's a little distracting and somewhat disrespectful to do that. So I'll just spoiler this out and let the initial view of the thread retain its purpose.

Spoiler for A point for further discussion?:
The main reason I responded, in particular, to your post was to offer my opinion on what I think is relevant and appropriate in such a thread like this and with the intention that my opinion will have some meaning. Whether it does or not isn't up to me, but it's there.

This is an interesting discussion, though, so perhaps either a separate thread or a PM is appropriate. It's important to me that I can understand and listen to other view points, so I'll likely see about a thread sometime.
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I'm liking the screenshots, I've always thought that if a scripter was to make a game, it'd probably have more features and usability than other RM games, looks like I'll get to find out on this one :yuyu:

Honestly, when I see a game with five pages of backstory in the description before I've even downloaded the game, I'm far less likely to play it. You should experience the story and learn the history of the setting in the game, not in a text-dump of a post.
I'm very guilty of doing that :o
All of my scripts are totally free to use for commercial use. You don't need to ask me for permission. I'm too lazy to update every single script post I ever made with this addendum. So ignore whatever "rule" I posted there. :)

All scripts can be found at: https://pastebin.com/u/diamondandplatinum3

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EDIT: I love it, but the battles seem to take too long, maybe i'm just impatient XD

Yeah, when you start out the battles can be a bit slow. They used to move a bit faster but that made it very hard for people to acclimate. After a few levels your speed picks up and battles go way faster. I'll see if I can find some way to speed them up without creating too much lag.

This looks pretty cool TDS. Downloading now~

Thanks, let me know what you think once you play it!
Love the concept and video! Will download soon!

Thanks, hope to hear what you think soon.

@Amycha19:

Many people have already explained it far better than I could so I won't go on about why there are no walls of text. You are probably not going to like the game very much if you need a lot of information to get into it. The game does provide with the option to learn about a lot of things early on though and characters do each have a unique backstory.

For example, using the character you asked about:

(Don't read if you don't want spoilers)
Spoiler for:
Blood is a Toralian, that is not a race but people who come from the Toral desert are called that. Toralians are not really trusted but people around the continent all use their services such as moving goods, constructions and information gathering.

Toralians live by a caste system in which they are assigned roles they follow throughout their whole lives and people who are born unable to fullfill those roles are basically thrown out into the desert to die. They are given no name and they only learn what little information is needed for them to perform their duty.

Blood doesn't have a name like many Toralians, he took his name after his body was badly burned and disfigured and he became unable to fulfill his
duties as a spy and assassin. The name Blood is what is caste role is.

After being disfigured, Blood along with some other Toralians started to gather those who have been thrown out into the desert to die. Mostly children who have been deemed unusable by leaders of the Toralian society.

There's  a lot more to it, but I don't really want to keep going.


Spoiler for Game thoughts:
I have a question though. I noticed that that long yellow? bar that depletes and then regenerates is how long you have in Rush Mode? What exactly is that? To me, it just appears to be a time limited battle speed up. Does it do anything else, or have I missed what it actually is anyway? Reason I ask is that I'm not really a fan of it if it's a simple time limited battle speed up mechanic, because it doesn't really add anything. With the battle system being as un-interactive as it is, I'd quite like a "get it over with" button to rush things along. Like any repetitive random battle system, it quickly gets dull and becomes an annoyance rather than an obstacle.

The yellow bar story-wise is the power that he gets at the start, it does a lot of things. It increases your critical rate, cuts down damage, increases your speed and a lot of other things. It's length increases during the story, depending on whether or not you decide to help people or not.

It's not really meant to be spammed to get the battles to end, it's more of a thing for emergencies or learning about new enemies. For example if you see a new enemy and you're not sure how strong it is you can save your "Battle Rush" to help you escape faster if the enemy turns out to be too tough to take out. You can also use it to quickly take out lower level enemies once your levels are high enough.



Spoiler for Discussion point: Escape as a strategy in random battles:

You are not going to win all battles, odds are pretty high that if you don't learn when to leave you're just going to die. After battles whether you win or escape you "Rest" which gives you back some HP, use this to your advantage to conserve your items.


I can see that this is a part of the strategy that's involved in surviving an encounter. And even though I read this part before I played the demo, it never actually crossed my mind to do so. In any RPG that's I've ever played, running away from a fight has never been an option unless forced. To me, a battle is a challenge that you are trying to beat and overcome and I try my best not to give up. This is what used to frustrate me in those old FF classic games that led you to a dungeon where enemies would just destroy you with no warning. Running away should be an option, not a necessity. And sometimes it can be a strategy, but its one that is best suited to tactical/strategy games rather than random battle orientated RPGs/games in general.

I do appreciate the strategy of escaping ("Live to fight another day" kind of thing). But in a game where the expectation on the player is to not have to run away, it would be at least an idea to tell players that the option exists and is a wise thing to keep in mind. There doesn't need to be a reward for it, because running away from a challenge should not be rewarding, but it should remind people that "Perhaps you need a bit more knowledge, or another approach, to overcoming this one". But, again, random battle games don't really favour the process of overcoming challenges. That's best left to boss fights and end game ventures. Whenever you came across a boss in an RPG and was unable to defeat them, you would level up and then try again. It's not as interesting as trying to teach re-evaluation and lateral thinking, but does have a similar essence underneath it.

The better games had some good mechanics involved, like FF7's materia system, that allowed you to try out different set-ups and approaches. I can see this game also having that element when you've got more party members and abilities, though I do worry that the pace of the battle system, and the lack of real interaction, will prevent a lot of players from being able to really analyse where they might be going wrong and figure out where to make changes.

If you speak to the NPC's around the castle they explain a lot of basic things such as keeping in mind escaping as an option. You are not really required to run away and if a person wants they could probably win every battle they encounter, but they would just end up wasting items and time on a battle too tough to win at the time.

As for a system to customize characters, I decided against it because the game is very short. That is why equipment is also removed, I can't keep adding systems that are really not going to have much of an effect in the game when each character already does.

[/quote]

That said, I downloaded this demo and I liked it quite a bit (though I did die during my first battle)! The beginning cutscene is a bit long, but since you can skip cutscenes it really isn't an issue. The writing could use some polish, yes, but this game is far more about the mechanics, which are quite exciting (I loved the feel of Half Minute Hero).

Thanks, and yeah a lot of people do die on their first battle. It helps a lot when it happens because they usually quickly learn to save often and use the cutscene skip command.

And yes, I do know my writing is nothing to write home about. If it gets too bad I'll see about finding someone to work with that can tackle writing better than me.

I'm liking the screenshots, I've always thought that if a scripter was to make a game, it'd probably have more features and usability than other RM games, looks like I'll get to find out on this one :yuyu:

Let me know what you think once you've played it.


And thanks to everyone for posting! Have a nice day!

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The yellow bar story-wise is the power that he gets at the start, it does a lot of things. It increases your critical rate, cuts down damage, increases your speed and a lot of other things. It's length increases during the story, depending on whether or not you decide to help people or not.

It's not really meant to be spammed to get the battles to end, it's more of a thing for emergencies or learning about new enemies. For example if you see a new enemy and you're not sure how strong it is you can save your "Battle Rush" to help you escape faster if the enemy turns out to be too tough to take out. You can also use it to quickly take out lower level enemies once your levels are high enough.


I see. That's an interesting use for it, and is something I should definitely keep in mind. It does help to know what it's purpose is, outside of seemingly speeding up fights. I think its the name "Battle Rush" that is (to me) easy to misunderstand. It's somewhat ambiguous. It's not a speed up, but rather a Rush of the Battle, like adrenalin. And that does have the benefit of making easier fights faster as a natural side effect.


If you speak to the NPC's around the castle they explain a lot of basic things such as keeping in mind escaping as an option. You are not really required to run away and if a person wants they could probably win every battle they encounter, but they would just end up wasting items and time on a battle too tough to win at the time.

As for a system to customize characters, I decided against it because the game is very short. That is why equipment is also removed, I can't keep adding systems that are really not going to have much of an effect in the game when each character already does.


When I mentioned the systems from other games, I was relating it to the setting up of ability priorities and how the battles will respond to those. By changing them up, you should be able to have more than enough customisation to allow a different reaction to the battle. Adding in more complexity than necessary is definitely a bad design choice, especially for a short game.
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I see. That's an interesting use for it, and is something I should definitely keep in mind. It does help to know what it's purpose is, outside of seemingly speeding up fights. I think its the name "Battle Rush" that is (to me) easy to misunderstand. It's somewhat ambiguous. It's not a speed up, but rather a Rush of the Battle, like adrenalin. And that does have the benefit of making easier fights faster as a natural side effect.

I wanted to call it "Sage Mode" or "Sage power", but a lot of the people testing it just kept comparing it to Naruto, so I decided on the Battle Rush name. If you have any suggestion for a better name, let me know.

Also as for the lack of explanation of features, I wanted people to find out things on their own by observing or playing. For example, during battle if the HP of a party member goes below a certain percent, Satiel will go into his own version of "Battle Rush" which allows him to tank hits better and increases his overall speed, this unlike rush mode can be exploited by having party members stay at low HP, but with enemies like Rafflesias it can up a dangerous gamble.

There's a lot of little things like that in the game that I don't really want to outright explain. I want someone to play the game and experience them.

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My first question is... how do I save? I understand that you must be standing on something important before the menu actually allows you to do so, but I expected the field map to allow you to by default :\
Same as everyone else, I lose my first battle ;9

Will need to give it another run sometime soon.
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My first question is... how do I save? I understand that you must be standing on something important before the menu actually allows you to do so, but I expected the field map to allow you to by default :\
Same as everyone else, I lose my first battle ;9

Will need to give it another run sometime soon.

Thank you for trying it out.

You can save anywhere, you just go to the menu and go the "Save" command and choose the slot to save in. You can also press the "ALT" + "Down" keys as a shortcut to go to the save menu from the map. The battle system also has similar shortcuts, just without the need to press "ALT".

However due to how short the demo is, there is no way at the moment to load your save files.

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However due to how short the demo is, there is no way at the moment to load your save files.
Does that mean the save menu is supposed to have greyed out options and play a custom buzzer when I try to select a savefile to save to?
That's what made me think I needed to be standing somewhere special.


I'd also like it if the game didn't force fullscreen onto me. I'm fine with it opening in fullscreen but when I alt+enter to toggle, it automatically goes back into fullscreen. Not a big issue, I just like windowed mode better :)
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You can save in the demo, you just can't load those files yet.

As for the full screen option, you can easily go out of it by pressing F5. I will add a system file to keep track of it's state so it will not go into full screen automatically at the start if you turned it off previously..

Edit:

Added a way to track the state of the full screen. Now if you press F5 and close the game it will remember the state it was left in.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2012, 06:52:12 AM by TDS »

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I've playtested :D

At first I was like WTF?!? and then I got beaten, pressed F12 because I wanted to shut it down but that doesn't work, so it restarted...

Which then I was glad about, I found out I can use a key to skip the blabbering and go to the game itself... Then I found out that in a battle you had to keep pressing ctrl or enter to do that stuff... Then I played it all the way to the end of the demo!!!

I like it though :)
My point in saying that you could have added some character info and stuff is that now, we have nothing about possible characters that join your party, while you could have easily made a character description being:
Satiel
{Face graphic}
He works for the royal guard.
Or something which gives readers an indication of what people they are or something.

But it doesn't matter if you don't want to do that.
Anyway. I like that your minimap shows threats but they go away if you kill one threat? Which I think is odd.
Also, what doest hearts do on the minimap? Since I let Satiel die a couple of times and the next battle, he was back with full health.
Then my final question to you: When will there be a next version of the demo? Or the complete game?

Anyway, interesting story inside the game. And I love the way Satial reacts when he meets the sage!!


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Whoa, pressing F5 makes it toggle between the modes really quickly, I usually need to wait about 10-15 seconds when full screen toggling RPGMaker Games on this computer, so that's a pleasant surprise. After that, just out of curiousity, I used alt+enter to see if your game would auto-revert it back to windowed, it didn't and it seemed to have taken about 30 seconds before the screen displayed it this time, was fullscreen so I pressed F5 which had no effect and actually seemed to make the program bug a little if held; pressing alt+enter again put it back to windowed. Hmm... I'm well-aware that it's my mistake for doing that, but I just wanted to test it out, maybe you're interested in hearing that :yuyu:



I noticed the mini-map, so it seems to predict where monster encounters are, I guess I skipped the enemies.
Battle with a wolf was cool too, though I wasn't paying a lot of attention and lost the sage, but hey I healed Satiel in time :D
And that's where the demo ended.



Well, not a lot to say. I liked the Castle theme, that was pretty good. The Battle seems pretty cool too, it makes me feel more like a player; since without me these guys will die (unlike other RPGs where your characters on auto could probably take care of themselves as if you were never there). I definitely like the ability to skip cutscenes and the mini-map; The menu is pretty cool-looking too ;8
I'm sure this will improve, so I'll stick around for the next one. ;)
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Then I found out that in a battle you had to keep pressing ctrl or enter to do that stuff... Then I played it all the way to the end of the demo!!!

Thank you for trying the demo. As for the controls in battle, I'm not sure if you mean that you had to keep pressing a key to do things instead of just keeping it pressed down. Some people have had that problem and thought they had to continuously press a key instead of just keeping it pressed.


Anyway. I like that your minimap shows threats but they go away if you kill one threat? Which I think is odd.
Also, what doest hearts do on the minimap? Since I let Satiel die a couple of times and the next battle, he was back with full health.
Then my final question to you: When will there be a next version of the demo? Or the complete game?

Anyway, interesting story inside the game. And I love the way Satial reacts when he meets the sage!!

It did use to just remove the troop you just fought instead of the whole area, but the people who play tested the system felt it was too cumbersome and defeated the purpose of being able to evade enemies. I think about it like you're beating a group of enemies then the others get scared of you and go away for a bit.

The hearts on the enemy radar are "Rest Points", when you touch them you recover some HP. They were supposed to be little tents, but people thought they were going to be fighting tents...

As for when the game will be finished, it really depends on whether or not enough people like it. A lot of the maps for the game are done and the story is finished, but I wanted to see if people actually liked the basic concepts of the game before continuing work or just going back to my scripting.

As for the when the game will be finished, it really depends on whether or not enough people respond to it. The maps and story are done, but if I can't get people to post something about it whether it be praise or criticism then I'm probably not doing the best I can with it, and that tells me that people see it, but they don't particularly care enough to try it or enjoy it, which means there are things about it that can be improved.

Whoa, pressing F5 makes it toggle between the modes really quickly, I usually need to wait about 10-15 seconds when full screen toggling RPGMaker Games on this computer, so that's a pleasant surprise. After that, just out of curiousity, I used alt+enter to see if your game would auto-revert it back to windowed, it didn't and it seemed to have taken about 30 seconds before the screen displayed it this time, was fullscreen so I pressed F5 which had no effect and actually seemed to make the program bug a little if held; pressing alt+enter again put it back to windowed. Hmm... I'm well-aware that it's my mistake for doing that, but I just wanted to test it out, maybe you're interested in hearing that :yuyu:

I already know it conflicts with the (Alt + Enter) fullscreen shortcut, but I have not found an effective way to disable.

I noticed the mini-map, so it seems to predict where monster encounters are, I guess I skipped the enemies.
Battle with a wolf was cool too, though I wasn't paying a lot of attention and lost the sage, but hey I healed Satiel in time :D
And that's where the demo ended.

Well, not a lot to say. I liked the Castle theme, that was pretty good. The Battle seems pretty cool too, it makes me feel more like a player; since without me these guys will die (unlike other RPGs where your characters on auto could probably take care of themselves as if you were never there). I definitely like the ability to skip cutscenes and the mini-map; The menu is pretty cool-looking too ;8
I'm sure this will improve, so I'll stick around for the next one. ;)

Just out of curiosity, is there any reason behind calling it a "Mini Map"? I keep calling it a radar, but people seem to call it a mini map even though it's not technically displaying a map. And yes, it's purpose is to allow you to evade enemies in an area.

And thank you for mentioning that you felt you're the only thing keeping those little guys alive, that was actually what I was trying to do with the battle system.

Thanks again for trying out the demo and posting. It really helps a lot.

Have a nice day.

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Okay, so I've played the demo, or, at least, I've played it as far as I could survive.

The plant things are very, very tough. I get that the rush mode pushes the enemies back further, and that pushing them back...kills them quicker? Or when they're pushed back far enough its an instant K.O.

It's a cool idea, and I was really into it the first time. But the plants do too much damage and the only thing I was really doing was keeping the characters alive and occasionally holding ENTER to push the plants back further when the meter filled up. I understand about escaping and avoiding encounters, but I feel like battles shouldn't be set up just for the purpose of escaping them--at least, not in a way where the player is just constantly dodging enemies and hitting the escape command. The radar is cool and all, kudos for creating it, but it just doesn't feel like a fun gameplay mechanic. I get what you're trying to do, and this is just my opinion, but I feel like you could accomplish putting an emphasis on picking one's battles carefully, in order to conserve resources, in a more...engaging way.

So, I like it. I'd like to see how it works when it feels a bit more balanced. I don't think that a game should require you to use potions every five seconds to survive.

As for the story, I really liked the part where Satiel was forced to "face himself". It made for an interesting way to establish his stake in the situation. I was hooked in because I didn't see it coming, but understood what was going on when it did. That's competent storytelling. I actually really like what I'm seeing in what little there is you've shown us.

So, overall: I'm intrigued by the story and the battle system, but I'm not sure I could stick with it if the whole point is to be constantly babysitting my guys' health bars (which is what I felt like I was doing).
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 09:38:51 PM by dudeguy119 »

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The hearts on the enemy radar are "Rest Points", when you touch them you recover some HP. They were supposed to be little tents, but people thought they were going to be fighting tents...

I'm afraid I had to find that humorous. Not because people thought that, but rather at the concept of fighting a tent. But, couldn't you think that hearts were also battles, and that something was going to happen similar to fighting tents? It's hard to think of a decent way of "iconifying" a rest point. A tent is a common RPG item used for resting it, and that's what I'd assume that to be.

Quote from: TDS
Just out of curiosity, is there any reason behind calling it a "Mini Map"? I keep calling it a radar, but people seem to call it a mini map even though it's not technically displaying a map. And yes, it's purpose is to allow you to evade enemies in an area.

I called it a mini-map because that's the first thing that came into my head upon seeing it to describe it. Radars are something you'd normally associate in an RPG (outside of a mini-game, at least).

For it's purpose, "radar" is a better name for it, but ,naturally, it will probably be referred to as a "mini-map", unless you write "radar" onto it somewhere.
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The plant things are very, very tough. I get that the rush mode pushes the enemies back further, and that pushing them back...kills them quicker? Or when they're pushed back far enough its an instant K.O.

Thank you for trying the demo.

And no, Rush mode does not push enemies back and pushing them further has no effect on enemies other than allowing you to attack those
behind them once you push them far enough. The "Push" stat is what affects the pushing of enemies.

It's a cool idea, and I was really into it the first time. But the plants do too much damage and the only thing I was really doing was keeping the characters alive and occasionally holding ENTER to push the plants back further when the meter filled up. I understand about escaping and avoiding encounters, but I feel like battles shouldn't be set up just for the purpose of escaping them--at least, not in a way where the player is just constantly dodging enemies and hitting the escape command. The radar is cool and all, kudos for creating it, but it just doesn't feel like a fun gameplay mechanic. I get what you're trying to do, and this is just my opinion, but I feel like you could accomplish putting an emphasis on picking one's battles carefully, in order to conserve resources, in a more...engaging way.

So, I like it. I'd like to see how it works when it feels a bit more balanced. I don't think that a game should require you to use potions every five seconds to survive.

Sounds like you're approaching the game like a typical RPG where you can mow down everything you encounter, here that is just going to make you waste all your items and most likely get your characters killed.

Some enemies are not meant to be faced when you first encounter them, you can do it if you want to, but all you're going to do is end up wasting your resources and using them more often. This  is not a lack of balance, it is simply a way to keep the players attention instead of expecting them to press a key and win with minimal requirement for strategy but with a high requirement for item management. If you think the game should allow you to win all battles easily without having to think, then you are not really going to enjoy the rest of the game.

As for the radar, I just created it based on Zelda II & 7th saga where you have a certain amount of control for encounters. It allows you to go from town to town without fighting a single fight if you want to, or you can easily go to an enemy if you want to grind or level up. In this sense it serves it's purpose completely.

However if you do have some suggestions about how any of the features can be improved, I would love to hear them.


I'm afraid I had to find that humorous. Not because people thought that, but rather at the concept of fighting a tent. But, couldn't you think that hearts were also battles, and that something was going to happen similar to fighting tents? It's hard to think of a decent way of "iconifying" a rest point. A tent is a common RPG item used for resting it, and that's what I'd assume that to be.

Yep, people thought they were going to be fighting hearts too and for some reason adding the word "Rest" to the icons led tester to believe it could be a boss heart/tent. Someone testing thought the hearts lead to (love scenes/Skits) if she collected enough of them.

At this point I've left it up to the player to experiment and find out things on their own, since not even short tutorials helped.

I was seriously thinking of adding a tent boss after that though.

Also has no one encountered any "Huge Enemies"? I thought those would be more problematic for people since they're basically really angry versions of normal enemies.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 10:53:39 PM by TDS »

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Update.

I've made a few changes to the battle system since a few people have recommended using bars instead of text. Also I've removed the old "bumper" in battle which allows the continuous display of damage which in turn allows battles to go faster.



I would like to know if the people who tried the first demo would like to test the new version with bars to tell me whether or not it's an improvement or what could be changed in it. I've also fixed most of the bugs reported such as the saving problem.

Thanks for reading and and have a nice day.

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I've updated the demo in the main post with a new one with all reported bugs fixed and new features.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/Silver%20Heart.exe

I know it might seem lazy to just work on this small part of the demo and replaying it a chore, but I would like to refine it as much as possible before reaching a point where it would just be too hard to do so.

The new features are.

  • Title Screen & Ability to load files.
  • Encounter Radar changed to remove a single enemy instead of clearing everything.
  • Battle Speed changer.
  • Some enemies have been toned down a bit.(Rafflesias can still hit Satiel hard, but not as hard as before (Keeping the Sage's HP higher than him should allow you to survive better.))
  • Enemy HP Bars instead of text.
  • Escape rates have been adjusted and the visual escape bug fixed.

One of the biggest changes is the "Battle speed changer", it allows you to change the speed of battles by pressing the "Left" or "Right" keys in battle. The current speed is shown by a ">" with ">>" being the top speed.



I added this because some people said they wanted battles to be faster, but I do not recommend it's use unless you know how to play well. Otherwise you could die very fast.

I would love to hear the thoughts of the people who tried the first demo and what they think of the new features, and of course the thoughts of everyone too.

Thanks for reading and have a nice day.

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Well just by the screenshot, the hp bars are already a massive improvement (at least to me, as I like bars better than numbers in these cases).
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Just finished the demo, and I really enjoyed it! The whole battle system was a bit confusing to me at first, but I got into it pretty fast! (Adding a tutorial about the battle system would be a plus later on though, cause at first glance Its really confusing). I really think Its awesome though, very different but alot of fun at the same time. I really liked the fact that you need to be on your toes aswell, or its pretty much game over. I cant imagine how the battle system would be with skills added aswell, that would be insanely sweet! :)

Another thing that struck me was your menu! Wow, Its absolutely fantastic!, and Adding the alt+ arrow shortcut was a very neat function. Also enjoyed the "battle map", really well done and works well for the concept!

Think you have tons of intersting mechanics, and I look forward to seeing your progress!

As for the story, I think Its promising.. even though the demo didnt tell much as it is.
Also, forgot the "skip cutscene" option! Thats something I would love to implement in my own game aswell, I have no idea on how Its done though, but Its a really neat feature!

Supporting this, and wish you luck on the project! :) 
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 01:04:51 AM by Dizturb3d »
Can you feel that?..

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@D&P3:

Thanks, let me know what you think if you try it out.

@Dizturb3d:

Thank you, it's always a great boost to the morale to read posts like yours. Glad you liked it.

As for a tutorial for the battle system, I'll start writing it soon. If there is anything specific you think people should know let me know so I can add it.

For skipping cutscenes I think there are 2 scripts, one made by myself and another one made by Kread-EX.

Here is the one by Kread-EX

http://grimoirecastle.wordpress.com/rgss3-scripts/utility-scripts/cutscene-skipper/

And here is the one I made.

http://rmrk.net/index.php/topic,45074.0.html

My script was made way back when VX Ace was released so it's probably not as optimized as newer scripts. I usually update scripts based on how many people use them and when there's no visible interest in them they usually get no updates, but if you do decide to use my version let me know so I can work on it so it's as optimized as possible.

Thanks for trying the demo and sharing your opinions.

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I might give the demo a try, but I wanna know how long the demo approximately takes to finish.
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I might give the demo a try, but I wanna know how long the demo approximately takes to finish.

Around 10-15 minutes I would say. Depends on how many battle encounters you will get though :)
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Thanks, just gave it a try.:lol:
Played up to my very first battle where I got my butt kicked. I didn't know what was going on, lol. Thought it was supposed to have some sort of turn-based system, but my characters were being under continuous attack. Then the game reset itself once my party died. Heheh.[/noob]

I just gotta say that I really enjoyed it up to the part of my first battle (lol).:lol: The story's fairly simple (which I like btw, not a fan of overly complex stories), but made up for it with the writing and the overall feel of quality to the game. I liked how you gave everyone an unique line of dialogue, including the castle guards (it's nice how they give you game tips btw), while keeping their texts short. I think I came across a minor typo or two, but overall it looks like you paid good attention to getting the writing done well.:lol:
What more can I say... the castle map looked nice, nothing really to comment on besides the fact that I liked it. Spent some seconds on the overworld map, looked alright.
Choice of music felt right.
To be honest I find it hard to come up with any criticism, except maybe the lack of explaining how the battle system works (or I'm just a blind noob for missing the tutorial?)
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@Milennin:

Thank you for giving the demo a try, and no you are not a noob because you died in your first battle, the battle system was designed to overwhelm you in many ways and people who die and try again seem to often enjoy the game much more than those who survive their first battle, who often have little interest in the game to start with and don't continue playing.

As for the tutorial, I've been working on it and most of the scripts related to it are almost done. Right now I'm just deciding whether to make it segmented (Allow the player to select what to learn) or just  a long tutorial that explains everything. Also trying to find music that fits the tutorial battle.

Here is an image of how the tutorial works when explaining the party status display:



It's more animated in action, but that's hard to convey in a still image. Also this is just some of the information, in the tutorial there is a bit more.

If there is anything you or anyone else would like explained better in a tutorial please let me know and I'll add it.

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@Milennin:

Thank you for giving the demo a try, and no you are not a noob because you died in your first battle, the battle system was designed to overwhelm you in many ways and people who die and try again seem to often enjoy the game much more than those who survive their first battle, who often have little interest in the game to start with and don't continue playing.

Thanks, the tutorial should help.:lol:
And yeah, I don't mind a game being difficult - a good challenge from the beginning is nice, actually, and a step up from the usual incredibly long and easy start RPG's tend to have - but not knowing what to do isn't fun. Maybe you could consider warning the player to save his game before going out into the field the first time. Because people generally expect the first some battles into the game to be pretty easy and not die horribly (lol), it's a bit disheartening to be sent right back to the beginning of the game upon getting killed in your first battle.
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How about replacing the heart icons by a red cross (+) sign which is (I guess) about pretty much all over the world a sign of help/first aid/...
I just asked my sis what the Red Cross (foundation) is and she just answered "Oh, doesn't that have something to do with doctors??"

I thought I was going to fight something too and when I first encountered it, I was like "Huh? No fighting? Then what is it for? Health maybe? Let's find another one to check it!"


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It's more animated in action, but that's hard to convey in a still image. Also this is just some of the information, in the tutorial there is a bit more.

If there is anything you or anyone else would like explained better in a tutorial please let me know and I'll add it.

That tutorial looks awesome! Im sure it will have a big impact when you enter your first battle, and erase any confusion that might pop up without it :) Fantastic job on your side!

You could always put up a small sample of the tutorial event when you are finished, so we can recall anything that you might want to add.

@Dizturb3d:
For skipping cutscenes I think there are 2 scripts, one made by myself and another one made by Kread-EX.

Here is the one by Kread-EX

http://grimoirecastle.wordpress.com/rgss3-scripts/utility-scripts/cutscene-skipper/

And here is the one I made.

http://rmrk.net/index.php/topic,45074.0.html

My script was made way back when VX Ace was released so it's probably not as optimized as newer scripts. I usually update scripts based on how many people use them and when there's no visible interest in them they usually get no updates, but if you do decide to use my version let me know so I can work on it so it's as optimized as possible.

Thanks for trying the demo and sharing your opinions.

I will look into those scripts after my first demo is released, thanks alot for sharing :)
At a first glance Im a little more interested in your script because it has an option to choose if you want to skip the cutscene with a "yes" or "no" choise. I will download it later on and see if I can make it work as I want it too.

And you are very welcome :)
« Last Edit: January 10, 2013, 08:18:31 AM by Dizturb3d »
Can you feel that?..

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@Milennin:

Yeah, I also feel a lot of RPG's start out way too easy and it is true that it's bad game design to not explain things properly. Also I think there is one of the NPC guards in the castle who tells you to save often.

One of the main reasons I decided to add enemies that are capable of killing you easily was because of a recent play-through of Radiant Historia. In many of the games first random battles enemies are very capable of taking you out if you don't know what you're doing or taking advantage of the battle mechanics. As for the lack of explanations I was playing way too much dark souls...

@Amycha19:

I think I will just mention in game what the symbols mean, the pixel artist I was working with had to leave due to personal reasons and may not return for a while, which means I have to work with the sprites I have.

@Dizturb3d:

Thanks, I will post the tutorial once it's done. Meanwhile here is an image of the segmented idea.



And thanks for posting everyone, it helps a lot to see the interest people have in your game when working on it.

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That font in the title screen... No... Please tell me that is not the font most people saw in their game. I forgot to add the font folder in the last update.

This is what it should look like.



I'm so sorry about forgetting to add the font folder. As for the font it's "Bella_Donna".

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I thought it looked weird. I just thought it was trying to resize itself to fit your widescreen game area and managed to screw up.
Didn't think it was a font issue :P
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Here is a battle tutorial demo for those of you may want to try and comment on it.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/Tutorial%20Demo/TUT%20Silver%20Heart.exe
(It's not a full demo, it's just my debug map with the tutorial and the parts that are finished.)

I'm still very surprised that the battle system requires a tutorial since it's basically bumping, so it's been hard trying to simplify that even more to explain it.

Even though it's not fully finished, I wanted to see if the parts that are done are doing a good job at explaining the battle system before finishing it all.

So, try it out and let me know.

Have a nice day.

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Here is a battle tutorial demo for those of you may want to try and comment on it.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/Tutorial%20Demo/TUT%20Silver%20Heart.exe
(It's not a full demo, it's just my debug map with the tutorial and the parts that are finished.)

At game start up it gives error Unable to find VL Gothic Font.
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It's the default font that comes with RPG Maker VX Ace (at the least, VX Ace comes with the font) and will likely require that you have said program installed to get it.

Hopefully, there's no issues with me attaching the font file to this post for those that need it to run this demo.



The tutorial is done very well I think. There's a lot of bars and colours and not enough information as to what those bars actually mean, until you've played the game a little and began to work it out. Whilst it doesn't have a huge learning curve, and I can understand to some degree why you would be surprised people are unsure about it, I think at least explaining Rush Mode and it's benefits (and reasons for why it should saved and not simply burned because it's there) is a good thing to do. Not only that, but it's a considerate thing to do in my books. You shouldn't assume everyone is going to understand it, even if it's a very simple system, and providing some information is always taken well (going overboard is going to bore people - you need a balance between informing someone and treating them like idiots).

I would suggest making sure that the tutorials are an easy to find, but optional, thing so that repeat players don't have to go through it. Although, it's not exactly difficulty to simply exit it so it's hardly a real inconvenience to them.
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@Milennin:

Sounds like you're missing the font that comes with RPG Maker VX Ace, I think having the RTP installed should fix that.

@LoganF:

I already know most of what you explained, what surprises me is that a tutorial is needed because a lot of people did not even try to learn. Just like I suspected a lot of the people who tried the tutorial commented that and I quote "Good, theres a tutorial. I didn't bother trying it before because of that lol".

As for Rush mode, It shouldn't take a genius to understand the concept of short lived power boosts. Many old games had them, like bombs in Contra. You know that bombs killed everything because you saw them do it, the game itself does not tell you unless you read a manual or try it out yourself and once you try it you see that you have a limited amount of them and wasting them for no reason would just leave you without them to use when could have needed them.

Rush mode is the same thing, a short burst of power and speed that you can use at your own discretion. You can waste it if you want, but it's better to save it if you want to escape or take out an enemy before it finishes preparing to use a skill.

I don't think it's asking for the moon for players to try and understand such a simple concept on their own without the need for an extended explanation and then allow them to be able to apply what they learn and  device their own strategies.

Also the tutorial is optional, you're prompted at an early part of the game as to whether or not you would like to take it.

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To be fair, the game doesn't really leave you with much time to test things out and learn on your own.
The enemies tend to get up on you pretty quickly so you can only really use what you've currently figured out to either win or escape.

Honestly (even though I suggested that a tutorial would be nice) just a battle at the beginning of the game against a dummy enemy would be pleasant; I'm not under the pressure of keeping an eye on 4 different bars and can get the feel for things that way.
That said, I still feel like this is one of the few battle systems where I feel like I'm needed.
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To be fair, the game doesn't really leave you with much time to test things out and learn on your own.
The enemies tend to get up on you pretty quickly so you can only really use what you've currently figured out to either win or escape.

Honestly (even though I suggested that a tutorial would be nice) just a battle at the beginning of the game against a dummy enemy would be pleasant; I'm not under the pressure of keeping an eye on 4 different bars and can get the feel for things that way.
That said, I still feel like this is one of the few battle systems where I feel like I'm needed.

I know that the first time I entered the battle, and subsequently ended up being KO'd, I had no idea what was going on. There's bars, there's some controls, and there was some text flying up the log window, and that's about it. My first impression was a little overwhelming, and I can understand why people might be put off.

I do agree that not even giving the game a try, perhaps because the screenshots made it look confusing, isn't really a good thing. I do believe in giving things a try, even if you are thrown in the deep end. But my first death wasn't one I enjoyed, and it didn't make me feel the desire to go play again.

As a gamer, I don't want my games to be too easy, nor do I want things hand fed to me. But I do expect that games give me the tools to at least understand the basics. I love challenges, that's for sure. But I don't have the time or the desire to figure things out from nothing. A simple hint like "Rush Mode boosts your power and speed for the time it's active" is all I'd require to make the conclusion that I should use it carefully.
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Perhaps you can try implementing the Rule of threes?

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@D&P3:

I think that working on this battle system for a very long period of time has made me unable to gauge the real speed of it against what I'm used to (To me battles are incredibly slow), I might have to consider someone for testing when it comes to speed related issues.

Also I wanted to make the first 10 battles of the game the same for everyone to show the types of enemies and what they could do, but because of the "Encounter Radar" people could just avoid them and miss that completely.

As for the dummy, that is not a bad idea. I might just add it in for people to practice on without the tutorial.


@LoganF:

Overwhelming was my goal and I've recently enjoyed a few RPG that have done that to me, but I think that may not be for everyone since only a few people have enjoyed it so far. The speed and the lack of instructions are a bad design choice if the person playing is approaching the game as a normal RPG and is not expecting to respond that quickly. Hopefully the tutorial helps more people be ready and the dummy battle allows them acclimate to the speed.

@IAMFORTE:

In the tutorial or gameplay?

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In a tutorial and in game play, turn off a few features to get the players used to everything, then slowly turn them on, that way they don't feel overwhelmed by it.

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@Milennin:

Sounds like you're missing the font that comes with RPG Maker VX Ace, I think having the RTP installed should fix that.

@LoganF:

I already know most of what you explained, what surprises me is that a tutorial is needed because a lot of people did not even try to learn. Just like I suspected a lot of the people who tried the tutorial commented that and I quote "Good, theres a tutorial. I didn't bother trying it before because of that lol".

Yeah, I'm missing the basic RTP. I'll try it out some time later then.
For the 2nd part of your quote. I wouldn't have minded to learn how the combat system works without a tutorial if it didn't sent me back to the very beginning of the game when my team died. Admittedly, it was my own fault for not making a save, but going by experiences with pretty much any other RPG I've played before, I didn't expect the need to save right after the game's introduction.
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@LoganF:

Overwhelming was my goal and I've recently enjoyed a few RPG that have done that to me, but I think that may not be for everyone since only a few people have enjoyed it so far. The speed and the lack of instructions are a bad design choice if the person playing is approaching the game as a normal RPG and is not expecting to respond that quickly. Hopefully the tutorial helps more people be ready and the dummy battle allows them acclimate to the speed.

I'd figured as much. In fact, that was going to be the point of the original post I was writing before I changed it. I can see what your initial design intentions were, and I can appreciate them for what they were. Ultimately, it comes down to what your target audience is. As it was, there were only a small group of players who would be able to enjoy the game as much as you do. If that's all you were looking for, then it really wasn't an issue in the first place.

But by taking some time to consider the other types of players who may need or want some kind of information can be a good choice. And because it will be optional, you're only increasing the number of players who will try the game out and stick with it. It shouldn't affect the original audience at all.

I'm not sure what your plans are for the dummy battle, but you could even have it as part of the tutorials. That way, players who don't care for the tutorials aren't subjected to that battle. It retains the idea that you can just ignore it if you want to and get on with the game.
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The tutorial for the battle system is finished and I've updated the demo with it.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61337936/Demos/RMRK%20SH%20Demo/Silver%20Heart.exe

An NPC will approach you shortly after you gain control of your character and offer to show you the tutorial. Afterwards you can view the tutorial anytime you want by talking to that NPC again.

@Milennin:

Added a line of text to the tutorial NPC to tell you to save before you leave the castle.

@LoganF:

Yeah, having a tutorial certainly doesn't hurt. I just hope I've conveyed the information clearly enough.

As for the dummy battle, it's a battle where you just fight a dummy enemy. The battle itself has no rewards or anything, but you can use your items and try the shortcuts like speeding up battles or calling menus without having to worry about a lot of enemies and dying quickly. And of course once the battle is done your HP is recovered and the items you used are returned to you.

If anyone had any problems understanding the battle system before let me know if the tutorial helped and if there is any other information you would like added.

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edit: Just played the tutorial. Looks good indeed, and explains the stuff I wanted to know.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2013, 04:08:14 PM by Milennin »
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I just finished playing the tutorial, it looks great and does its job admirably! Good job!

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Thanks for trying it out. It's great to hear the tutorial is helping out.

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Just posting to update and let people know that I'm still working on the game.

I've been reviewing the feedback people have given me from the demo and I've been trying to improve the game.

One of the new additions is the "Battle Retry" system.



When you're defeated in battle a prompt will appear asking you if you would like to retry the battle. This will not always be a lifesaver since it will return you as you were when the battle started, but it should alleviate the problem of having to return to the title screen because you forgot to save which is what seems to happen in most instances.

Most of the other additions to the game are mostly visual effects like the "Bubble prompt" and transition effects.



A bubble will appear whenever a point of interest or something hidden near the player.


Sadly, it's not all good news. I had to switch from MIDI to OGG because of a script I created and the music I am using does not have proper looping in it (loopstart and looplength) and the long pauses are too noticeable to ignore. Also It takes me 5 to 8 hours just to find a decent loop in a 40 second song and even then when I test the song I still hear a click or beep because it's not a precise loop.

That means that even though I'm currently using about 10 songs, it's going to take me 80+ hours just find and set their proper loops. And this has set back the progress of the game a lot since I can only work on it 2~3 hours a day.


And I want to end the update in a good note, so here is a preview of a scene in the game I've been working on.


 
Thanks for reading and have a nice day!

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Very cool stuff TDS. I like the Battle Retry option a lot, and that scene is looking good.

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Lookin Good TDS :D