This Shit is disgusting

[chewey]

On a note, I find abortion, needed for some people, though I don't support it but Im not against it. Just I feel its a part of life, unfortunately for many people they're against while many are for it. Some are in the middle, and just accept it.

What?

[Ruzu]

Nothing, ignore me. I was just ranting and whatnot.

[modern algebra]

That is extremely ego-centric of you.
Considering that it's happening in -their- country, and we are totally uninvolved, I'd say it's -our- point of view that doesn't matter.

Just out of curiosity, would you say the same if it were a topic of human rights violations, such as genocide? I think that as a human race, we should care about things that are happening to other human beings even if they are not within our national or cultural borders. Whether a fetus is human or not is obviously not something universally agreed upon, but where a person thinks it is, I don't see the argument that "it's not here, therefore we shouldn't care" as particularly convincing. I would say that might be the more egocentric opinion, as it is ostensibly saying that we shouldn't care about other human beings unless they share our cultural perspective.

That being said, I do understand concerns about imposing our cultural norms on other people and colonialism is bad and all, but I don't see why a recognition of that should translate to not caring about other human beings in other cultures. And where the human rights violations are grave, I think that that could justify forceful action on the part of other nations. I don't think cannibalism is grave enough, even if we were to accept that fetuses are human, but I also don't think that it's egocentric to condemn it.

[EvilM00s]

I see many of us are trying hard to see this from an accepting point of view, which I suppose is good- acceptance of others is always welcome in the world. I guess I threw out a few poorly thought out opinions because of the shock value. I'm gonna leave this one alone from now on because I can't think of it in any other way except through my own eyes, and I just can't get over the fact that a human fetus is being boiled for lunch. I like to think of myself as fairly progressive and open minded, but I just can't do it this time.

Thanks for your counter points, guys, if nothing else, it makes a really good debate. I'll exit this conversation with something I found while playing Year Zero a couple of years back. Food for thought... no pun intended.

[tSwitch]

I didn't say we shouldn't care.  I said we shouldn't judge.

I don't agree with cannibalism, but I am not going to judge the culture that it's included in.

[Holkeye]

What? This isn't just cannibalism, its infanticide/cannibalism. Of course I'm going to judge it. Its fucked up.

[Irock]

That isn't how stem cells work, idiots.

[chewey]

Yeah, idiots.

[Dertt]

They're doing it wrong.
It's fetus dumplings which have preternatural qualities.

[modern algebra]

I didn't say we shouldn't care.  I said we shouldn't judge.

Again, I'm taking a more general approach to this than just the situation at hand, but:

It seems to me that to care effectually, the very least that is required is to judge the perpetrator to have committed a wrong. To say, "I care that your family was massacred by some militant faction, but that's just part of their culture so I'm not going to judge them" is a particularly ineffectual caring. It is even more problematic if it is used as a justification not to interfere in order to prevent some future massacre. It seems to me that there can be no real line separating judgement and caring. In order to care that something bad has happened or is happening, we have to judge the behaviour that results in that "something bad" as being wrong. If we categorize the behaviour as wrong, then the actors must be doing something wrong, and we are thus implicitly stating that whatever reasons the actor might have (including cultural background) for that behaviour is insufficient to justify the wrong. In some cases, we might care more about preserving cultural autonomy than we do about the individuals harmed by that culture's practice, but in those cases I would still categorize it as a lack of any effectual type of care.

In any case, I am not sure if a cultural analysis would be entirely appropriate to apply to the situation in this thread (even though I am assuming it is a hoax), as cannibalism is not a cultural norm in China. If a community in Iowa took up ritualistic (and voluntary) human sacrifice, I don't think it would be appropriate to infer a cultural immunity to that when it should be clear from the laws of the US that such behaviour is unnacceptable, even though the victims volunteer and nobody in the community considers the behaviour to be aberrant.

[Jules]

I love reading Modern Algebra's posts.  He always says what I want to say far better than I could ever say it.  Awesome =)

[Grafikal]

mm babies.

[tSwitch]

My stance is that we don't have a right to tell the rest of the world how to live just because we're America.  
Our culture doesn't define what human rights mean, it doesn't define what morality and right and wrong are, anywhere other than in America.

That's why I'm saying put things in perspective.  If cannibalism or even infanticide is part of another culture and has been for a long time or whatever, then by all means disagree with it strongly and don't do it yourself, but you can't very well hold another culture to your standards just because you happen to not like their standards.

To give a more easily understood example, I disagree strongly with how the gay community is handling the rights movement.  I don't agree with parading down the street waving rainbow flags and making out on floats and forcing everyone in the city to watch it happen, and I don't agree with forcing people to go against their morals or their beliefs to marry gay couples.  Because it's -forcing- one culture or one mindset onto someone else, which I personally feel is a greater injustice.  (no I'm not opening the floor to a gay rights debate, I was simply making an example)

And by all means continue to judge if you feel you must because I shouldn't be forcing my mindset on anyone else either.  I just feel it is disrespectful and inconsiderate not to take into account that the topic has nothing to do with our culture and the culture it has everything to do with is treated as though it doesn't matter simply because the issue happens to be taboo and questionable in our own.

I suck at explaining things clearly.

[Grafikal]

For some reason, I think you are me...

It's possible.

[Dertt]

mm babies.

omg grafikal!

NO JOKE, I literally was going to say exactly that.

For some reason, I think you are me...

Nah, lots of people find babies delectable.