iPhone OS 4 - Multitasking and more

Either way, I'm happy to see a closed, severely and deliberately limited platform like apple's OS falling in market share, with the open source and free (in all senses of the word) Android OS poised to replace it as #1

Android is on many different phones across many different carriers, while Apple's iPhone OS is only on the iPhone (which is only on AT&T) and iPod Touch(if they count that in this graph). It's no surprise that it could surpass it in market share.

I know plenty of people who want an iPhone, but can't get one because they're already on another carrier, me included.

The iPhone isn't doing bad at all.

I didn't see him say it was doing bad. I saw him write that it was falling. Also, yes, it makes sense that Android would be growing.

He's obviously implying that its market share percentage is falling because it's a "severely and deliberately limited platform" and that its falling in market share percentage is bad for Apple, when they did better than ever last quarter. He also failed to even recognize the obvious reason it's falling.

Roph either doesn't understand anything, or he wants to make it seem like Apple is doing badly.

iPod's operating system has very little to do with why it sells well. It's an iPod.

The iPod Touch would not sell nearly as well if the operating system were bad. The software sells the hardware.

Same with the iPad and the iPhone.

It's not that it's bad or good. It's just functional.

Sometimes I hate those bastards. Why the hell won't they let it work on the iPod Touch 2nd Gen? Why in ****'s name?

Looks really nice for those who can use it, though.

Many features will work on the iPod Touch 2nd gen. But, multi-tasking won't since the hardware just can't do it well.

Oh man, I just read it to fast... sorry for that.

Multitasking is nothing for me compared to the fact that you FINALLY can change your background! Or the App Folders! Can't wait.

Oh and Irock, thanks for all the information; without you I wouldn't have noticed it.

IROCK DECIDED TO SKIP HTML AND NOW KNOWS EVERYTHING ABOUT HTML5

I don't understand your post nor claim to know anything about HTML5 other than if I had to replace Flash, I'd replace it with it.

Do you understand that flash is, for the most part, open?

The flash player itself cannot be open source because of some of the code it contains - namely codecs for proprietary media formats such as h.264.

I love h.264 and AAC, which are both patented formats. Software patents are a tricky area and I agree they suck for many reasons; but I don't understand the flash hate.

When I play HD youtube videos I get comparable CPU usage to if I were to download the HD MP4 from youtube and play it in a standalone player.

I never said Flash isn't for the most part, open. Jesus, I've had a billion words shoved in my mouth so you people can make arguments out of nothing.

I just don't want Flash on the iPad, iPhone, or iPad. Quite frankly, it sucks on devices with lesser hardware and devices with touch screens. I don't want any pages to render slower because of it, I don't want any applications slowing down because of it, I don't want the device to be unstable because of it, and I don't want to see a bunch of Flash applications that aren't even going to work because they're designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse. Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have something on their devices that could impact the performance or user experience. Talking about performance, Flash even rapes netbooks I've used.

I don't have a problem with Flash; I have a problem with Flash on devices that don't handle Flash well.

Also, why the fuck would I care if it's open?

what is html replacing besides video and flash? (serious question, I have yet to read up myself on it's 'flash' killing abilities)

So you're happy for apple to force you to use what they want you to use, rather than the other way around? Even though lots of flash content would work perfectly, if the user was simply allowed to use it?

Want to use flash on another, less restricted device? go ahead. Their open-ness is what gives the choice to the user.

This is how your arguments against flash come back to open-ness of the device, and why I have no interest in owning or using those apple products.

I never said Flash isn't for the most part, open. Jesus, I've had a billion words shoved in my mouth so you people can make arguments out of nothing.

So what you're saying is...you're ignoring the truth?

I just don't want Flash on the iPad, iPhone, or iPad. Quite frankly, it sucks on devices with lesser hardware and devices with touch screens.

Don't be so quick to label all devices with touch screens as unable to use Flash properly.  iMobileDevices sure, but for example I know several touch screen computers that run Flash fine, because they don't sacrifice hardware for touch.

I don't want any pages to render slower because of it, I don't want any applications slowing down because of it, I don't want the device to be unstable because of it, and I don't want to see a bunch of Flash applications that aren't even going to work because they're designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse.

Pages won't be slower if the Flash author isn't an idiot and doesn't know how to compress, the device wouldn't slow down if it wasn't running gimped hardware, and as for keyboard and mouse, there is a keyboard dock for it and bluetooth, but of course Apple doesn't include any options for a mouse, which I find extremely stupid and clumsy.  Typan on the keyboard then have to move your hand up to the screen to select anything?  Dumb.

Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have something on their devices that could impact the performance or user experience.

I'll define for people.

performance - locked-down nature of the device, preventing any form of app being run that doesn't pass through the App Store and conform to Apple standards.
user experience - the decided uses for the device as dictated by Apple.

Talking about performance, Flash even rapes netbooks I've used.

Netbooks suck too.

I don't have a problem with Flash; I have a problem with Flash on devices that don't handle Flash well.

...because of gimp hardware.

Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have something on their devices that could impact the performance or user experience.

Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have something on their devices that could impact the performance of their hardware.

Irock step back from the apple is doing it for you. They just banned screen protectors at their retail outlets. Wait let me guess.

Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have screen protectors on their devices that could impact the performance or user experience.

No. They did it so people don't feel their product is inferior, same with flash. If they supported flash they would probably need to provide better hardware with the product--fuck that right?

So you're happy for apple to force you to use what they want you to use, rather than the other way around? Even though lots of flash content would work perfectly, if the user was simply allowed to use it?

Apple can't force me to use anything, and I shouldn't be able to force them to use anything. Apple puts on their device what consumers want, because they make more money that way. A lot of Flash content would not work, and that content that wouldn't work would only lessen the performance of the device.

Want to use flash on another, less restricted device? go ahead. Their open-ness is what gives the choice to the user.

You have the choice. I'd rather take a device with a better operating system, better applications, more applications, a better touch screen, and better build quality. I have no need for Flash or for Apple to allow a bunch of shitty applications to be downloaded from the web.

This is how your arguments against flash come back to open-ness of the device, and why I have no interest in owning or using those apple products.

I don't care if something is "open". I want the best experience I can get, and no other device has impressed me more than the iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad.

I've never cared that you don't want an Apple product. You don't need to tell me why, because I've never tried to convince you to get one or questioned why you don't want an Apple product.

So what you're saying is...you're ignoring the truth?

That makes no sense.

Don't be so quick to label all devices with touch screens as unable to use Flash properly.  iMobileDevices sure, but for example I know several touch screen computers that run Flash fine, because they don't sacrifice hardware for touch.

The touch screen isn't going to work well with many Flash applications which are designed to be used with a mouse and keyboard.

I don't want any pages to render slower because of it, I don't want any applications slowing down because of it, I don't want the device to be unstable because of it, and I don't want to see a bunch of Flash applications that aren't even going to work because they're designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse.

Pages won't be slower if the Flash author isn't an idiot and doesn't know how to compress, the device wouldn't slow down if it wasn't running gimped hardware, and as for keyboard and mouse, there is a keyboard dock for it and bluetooth, but of course Apple doesn't include any options for a mouse, which I find extremely stupid and clumsy.  Typan on the keyboard then have to move your hand up to the screen to select anything?  Dumb.

No, pages will be slower. Flash applications, unavoidably, use CPU. No matter how good a Flash "programmer" you are, it will use hardware on the device which will cause it to slow down. You're also disregarding the fact that a lot of Flash applications aren't made well, and will REALLY slow down the device. If it slows down a Netbook with greater specs than the iPad, it will slow down the iPod Touch, iPhone and iPad.

Apple doesn't allow a mouse to connect to the iPad because the OS, and every single application is designed to be used with multi-touch. It just wouldn't work. The very fact that you think having a mouse on an iPad would be a good thing shows how dumb you are. Your perfect device is something with as many features crammed into it as the developers could fit into it, is it not? Any developer with a device with a bunch of half assed bullshit on it, is clumsy -- not the developer who makes sure everything that they allow their device to do works perfectly. The last thing Apple is, is clumsy.

Apple isn't stupid. They don't want to have something on their devices that could impact the performance or user experience.

I'll define for people.

performance - locked-down nature of the device, preventing any form of app being run that doesn't pass through the App Store and conform to Apple standards.
user experience - the decided uses for the device as dictated by Apple.

Performance as in, speed.

User experience as in, user experience. Apple wants applications and features that make their users enjoy using the device. I'd personally be pissed at Apple if they allowed a mouse that doesn't function correctly on the iPad, a ton of porn applications, applications that violate my privacy, applications that are buggy, and Flash that will be usable sometimes and will slow down the device.

Talking about performance, Flash even rapes netbooks I've used.

Netbooks suck too.

Yes, because they run full blown operating systems that don't consider how low the specifications of the system are. Unless you're using one of those OS's that the manufacturer included that has like 6 basic features. But god, I'd rather just have an iPad. =]

I don't have a problem with Flash; I have a problem with Flash on devices that don't handle Flash well.

...because of gimp hardware.

These devices are not supposed to have 4 gigs of ram, a quad core, and a 4850 graphics card.

The touch screen isn't going to work well with many Flash applications which are designed to be used with a mouse and keyboard

Games maybe, but Flash isn't just used for games

Apple can't force me to use anything, and I shouldn't be able to force them to use anything. Apple puts on their device what consumers want, because they make more money that way. A lot of Flash content would not work, and that content that wouldn't work would only lessen the performance of the device.

and from later on...

developer who makes sure everything that they allow their device to do works perfectly.

No, pages will be slower. Flash applications, unavoidably, use CPU. No matter how good a Flash "programmer" you are, it will use hardware on the device which will cause it to slow down. You're also disregarding the fact that a lot of Flash applications aren't made well, and will REALLY slow down the device. If it slows down a Netbook with greater specs than the iPad, it will slow down the iPod Touch, iPhone and iPad.

Lol Flash "programmer."
No matter how good an App "Programmer" you are, it will use hardware on the device which will cause it to slow down. You're also disregarding the fact that a lot of Apps aren't made well, and will REALLY slow down the device (and eat up more battery life than they are worth).

Apple doesn't allow a mouse to connect to the iPad because the OS, and every single application is designed to be used with multi-touch. It just wouldn't work. The very fact that you think having a mouse on an iPad would be a good thing shows how dumb you are.

Lol.
Because every single app ever is going to feature Multi Touch something.
When you have the iPad propped up and have to use the screen to navigate while using the keyboard to type, it's clumsy and stupid.  Also their new special snowflake mouse has multi-touch capabilities so weak argument is weak.

Your perfect device is something with as many features crammed into it as the developers could fit into it, is it not? Any developer with a device with a bunch of half assed bullshit on it, is clumsy -- not the developer who makes sure everything that they allow their device to do works perfectly. The last thing Apple is, is clumsy.

My perfect device is one with a good powerful framework and open capabilities for user modification of the function and look.  Basically standard PC and with some work standard Apple Laptops.

User experience as in, user experience. Apple wants applications and features that make their users enjoy using the device. I'd personally be pissed at Apple if they allowed a mouse that doesn't function correctly on the iPad, a ton of porn applications, applications that violate my privacy, applications that are buggy, and Flash that will be usable sometimes and will slow down the device.

OH NOES PORN!
I'm pretty sure they could make mice work perfectly fine, and you seriously think that the iPad being locked down like a maximum security prison is going to stop people from making applications that attempt to violate privacy, or keep bugs?

Everything you do on the device will eat the battery, use the hardware, and probably slow it down because it's using such gimp hardware for what they're trying to make it do.

Yes, because they run full blown operating systems that don't consider how low the specifications of the system are. Unless you're using one of those OS's that the manufacturer included that has like 6 basic features. But god, I'd rather just have an iPad. =]

Netbooks run streamlined versions with less features, very hardly full blown, it's not the OS that is the difference.

These devices are not supposed to have 4 gigs of ram, a quad core, and a 4850 graphics card.

stop contradicting yourself.

No, pages will be slower. Flash applications, unavoidably, use CPU.

The touch screen isn't going to work well with many Flash applications which are designed to be used with a mouse and keyboard

Games maybe, but Flash isn't just used for games

No, many Flash applications require you to hover a mouse over something for certain features. Take, for example, the Youtube player.

Apple can't force me to use anything, and I shouldn't be able to force them to use anything. Apple puts on their device what consumers want, because they make more money that way. A lot of Flash content would not work, and that content that wouldn't work would only lessen the performance of the device.

and from later on...

developer who makes sure everything that they allow their device to do works perfectly.

No, pages will be slower. Flash applications, unavoidably, use CPU. No matter how good a Flash "programmer" you are, it will use hardware on the device which will cause it to slow down. You're also disregarding the fact that a lot of Flash applications aren't made well, and will REALLY slow down the device. If it slows down a Netbook with greater specs than the iPad, it will slow down the iPod Touch, iPhone and iPad.

Lol Flash "programmer."
No matter how good an App "Programmer" you are, it will use hardware on the device which will cause it to slow down. You're also disregarding the fact that a lot of Apps aren't made well, and will REALLY slow down the device (and eat up more battery life than they are worth).

Apple will not let an application that runs slowly into the app store. Apple can not control what Flash content is displayed, so there will be Flash applications that slow down, and Apple wouldn't be able to do anything to fix that.

Apple doesn't allow a mouse to connect to the iPad because the OS, and every single application is designed to be used with multi-touch. It just wouldn't work. The very fact that you think having a mouse on an iPad would be a good thing shows how dumb you are.

Lol.
Because every single app ever is going to feature Multi Touch something.
When you have the iPad propped up and have to use the screen to navigate while using the keyboard to type, it's clumsy and stupid.  Also their new special snowflake mouse has multi-touch capabilities so weak argument is weak.

Every application is designed to use a multi-touch screen, their operating system is as well. It isn't clumsy or stupid; iPad users are loving the keyboard dock for having their iPad stand up on their desk for use or for typing. I don't see how it's clumsy or stupid at all.

Apple's Magic Mouse doesn't have a screen on it that shows where in the app/os you're going to touch. The Magic Mouse is for gestures, not using multi-touch apps that are designed for use on a multi-touch screen. Now trying to do THAT would be clumsy and stupid.

Dumb namkcor is dumb.

User experience as in, user experience. Apple wants applications and features that make their users enjoy using the device. I'd personally be pissed at Apple if they allowed a mouse that doesn't function correctly on the iPad, a ton of porn applications, applications that violate my privacy, applications that are buggy, and Flash that will be usable sometimes and will slow down the device.

OH NOES PORN!
I'm pretty sure they could make mice work perfectly fine, and you seriously think that the iPad being locked down like a maximum security prison is going to stop people from making applications that attempt to violate privacy, or keep bugs?

I'm sure they couldn't make mice work perfectly fine.

The main reason the application store requires that Apple approve applications is to ensure quality. The reason doesn't even matter. The fact is, it ensures quality in the app store. The majority of applications that are rejected are because of bugs.

Everything you do on the device will eat the battery, use the hardware, and probably slow it down because it's using such gimp hardware for what they're trying to make it do.

Are you saying their devices aren't capable what Apple is trying to make their device do? What?

Apple approves applications which ensures that the applications function fine, they can't approve Flash applets.

Yes, because they run full blown operating systems that don't consider how low the specifications of the system are. Unless you're using one of those OS's that the manufacturer included that has like 6 basic features. But god, I'd rather just have an iPad. =]

Netbooks run streamlined versions with less features, very hardly full blown, it's not the OS that is the difference.

Really? The Netbooks I've used run Windows and possibly a very small operating system with just a few features that's selectable at boot.

These devices are not supposed to have 4 gigs of ram, a quad core, and a 4850 graphics card.

stop contradicting yourself.

No, pages will be slower. Flash applications, unavoidably, use CPU.

How is that a contradiction? Do you even know what a contradiction is? The iPad, iPhone, and iPod Touch are not supposed to have 4 gigs of ram, a quad core, and a 4850 graphics card. This is a reason why Flash wouldn't work on the device. Flash is a bad idea on these devices.

Apple will not let... Apple can not control...
(later on)
Apple is trying to make their device do?

I think this is exactly what it boils down to.

Every application is designed to use a multi-touch screen, their operating system is as well. It isn't clumsy or stupid; iPad users are loving the keyboard dock for having their iPad stand up on their desk for use or for typing. I don't see how it's clumsy or stupid at all.

Apple's Magic Mouse doesn't have a screen on it that shows where in the app/os you're going to touch. The Magic Mouse is for gestures, not using multi-touch apps that are designed for use on a multi-touch screen. Now trying to do THAT would be clumsy and stupid.

Dumb namkcor is dumb.

...

I'm sure they couldn't make mice work perfectly fine.

How do you know that every app uses multi-touch?
Do you own the iPad and know what developers are making?

Also I'm pretty sure that Apple could make it so that OH LOOK THERE'S A MOUSE, LET'S SHOW A POINTER ON THE SCREEN.  Touch computers (sorry) LIFESTYLE DEVICES are clumsy at their base, the iPad is no exception.

Also that last part there in bold made me lol.  Big bad Apple can't make THEIR computer work with THEIR mouse?  Hardly.

Really? The Netbooks I've used run Windows and possibly a very small operating system with just a few features that's selectable at boot.

Hate to break it to you, but Windows for Netbooks is castrated.

How is that a contradiction?

Why would the video card have to do with anything, you said Flash used the CPU not the video card

Do you know how to debate with someone without resorting to name-calling and childish insults?  Didn't think so.

Apple will not let... Apple can not control...
(later on)
Apple is trying to make their device do?

I think this is exactly what it boils down to.

And that's one of the reasons why the iPad iPod Touch, and iPad are so great. Apple ensures quality.

Every application is designed to use a multi-touch screen, their operating system is as well. It isn't clumsy or stupid; iPad users are loving the keyboard dock for having their iPad stand up on their desk for use or for typing. I don't see how it's clumsy or stupid at all.

Apple's Magic Mouse doesn't have a screen on it that shows where in the app/os you're going to touch. The Magic Mouse is for gestures, not using multi-touch apps that are designed for use on a multi-touch screen. Now trying to do THAT would be clumsy and stupid.

Dumb namkcor is dumb.

...

I'm sure they couldn't make mice work perfectly fine.

How do you know that every app uses multi-touch?
Do you own the iPad and know what developers are making?

Also I'm pretty sure that Apple could make it so that OH LOOK THERE'S A MOUSE, LET'S SHOW A POINTER ON THE SCREEN.  Touch computers (sorry) LIFESTYLE DEVICES are clumsy at their base, the iPad is no exception.

Also that last part there in bold made me lol.  Big bad Apple can't make THEIR computer work with THEIR mouse?  Hardly.

Every application is designed for use on a multi-touch screen, not for use with mice. People would buy this mouse then find out that it doesn't do a whole lot of anything.

How are they "clumsy"? I've never heard anyone complain about the iPad being "clumsy"

The iPad is not *designed* to be used with a mouse -- the entire idea that it's a touch device sells it, and there's absolutely no advantage to using a mouse on the iPad. If you want to use a mouse, use your desktop or laptop, which are designed for use with a mouse.

Really? The Netbooks I've used run Windows and possibly a very small operating system with just a few features that's selectable at boot.

Hate to break it to you, but Windows for Netbooks is castrated.

Really? And it still runs like shit? I guess Apple is doing this stuff right.

How is that a contradiction?

Why would the video card have to do with anything, you said Flash used the CPU not the video card

I'm telling you that these devices aren't supposed to have magnificent specs.

Do you know how to debate with someone without resorting to name-calling and childish insults?  Didn't think so.

Dumb.

The iPad is not *designed* to be used with a keyboard -- the entire idea that it's a touch device sells it, and there's absolutely no advantage to using a keyboard on the iPad. If you want to use a keyboard, use your desktop or laptop, which are designed for use with a keyboard.

...wait.

Also way to take the "dumb" out of context.
Here, let me get the whole sentence for you.

Typan on the keyboard then have to move your hand up to the screen to select anything?  Dumb.

Unless English fails to adhere to its own rules, you'd notice that Dumb is a statement talking about the previous sentence, the concept of having to move your hand to the screen from the detachable keyboard (thereby obscuring quite a portion of the screen, but that's a given since you can't do anything without putting fingers all over it and blocking out the screen with your palm) being clumsy and dumb.

Also of course Netbooks run slowly for anything other than basic web browsing and word processing, they are castrated laptops running castrated operating systems.  Just because the iPad can do meaningless things that  faster than castrated laptops doesn't mean the iPad is any better.

So you're happy for apple to force you to use what they want you to use, rather than the other way around? Even though lots of flash content would work perfectly, if the user was simply allowed to use it?

Apple can't force me to use anything, and I shouldn't be able to force them to use anything. Apple puts on their device what consumers want, because they make more money that way. A lot of Flash content would not work, and that content that wouldn't work would only lessen the performance of the device.

No; that doesn't even make sense. If you're given the option to toggle flash on/off any time you wish, it would be a positive thing because you could actually use the web as it was intended to be used. If I use Flashblock I can simply click any flash object and have it go, as well as add sites to the list of exceptions. Don't like the flash object? Have a little button in the bottom of the screen (or in a menu) that'll stop it, for the entire page or otherwise. Either way, there's clearly a market for people who want to use flash, and that's what makes money. Sure, some of it wouldn't work but at least you can choose! Hell, for what it's worth it could even be disabled by default (the entire feature).

I also agree with Nam. Touch devices with a (physical) keyboard are rather clumsy, but at the very least you're given the option.

 

IT STILL BLENDS LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE =o