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10 states line up to sue over health bill

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You guys should just copy England. Or maybe France. Or even Germany. There is literally no industrialised country in the world that has worth healthcare than America does, and no country pays anywhere even remotely near as much either. I don't have any "plan" or any paperwork, anything like that. I don't have to worry about any money in regards to healthcare, no matter how much or how little I make. If I require care, I get it. It's really that simple.

Private healthcare exists in the UK, companies like Bupa or this other one whose name I forget exist, but nobody uses them. Why pay, when the NHS is free and is brilliant?

I'm sure now Irock would like to step in and link a news story about a random English citizen who died or had late treatment or something, to which I say - welcome to the laws of averages. When you're dealing with millions, of course perfection is impossible. The current American death toll though is unacceptable and indeed possible to remedy, and those who literally go and protest healthcare should be ashamed of themselves.

One of the big issues with your healthcare are price controls that are set. You say you're only going to spend x% of money on health care. There's a cap on it.

And yet it is still much, much better, no matter which way you rate it.

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Most pharmaceutical drugs and medical technology that save lives are produced in the United States because it costs an immense amount of money for research and development. The reason companies produce these drugs is for profit. In European countries, they set price controls. There's no profit and there's not enough money to spend on it. The very reason drugs are developed here is because we don't have your system.

That is incorrect. "Source"? And I don't have to pay for drugs. I would pay a simple administration fee (something like £1.50) for them to be fetched and delivered to me, no matter if they "cost" £5 or £500. If my healthcare requires that I have them, then I can get them. I just get a prescription. You get laughed at on the news here by ridiculous prices you have to pay for arbitrary drugs / equipment. And England does have a private healthcare system, that works just like America's. Nobody uses it.

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Life expectancy, which you've brought up several times before, is not determined by the health care. There are many factors, such as auto accident rates, murder rates and personal health decisions such as obesity. You're essentially saying that because we have a lower life expectancy, the cause is our healthcare.

Not THE, but definitely one of. Your own government has this stance also.

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A better thing to look at is from the time you're diagnosed with an illness to the time you're likely to be cured. In most cases, the time is simply lower in the United States.

Source? There is no bothering about whether or not you can afford it, your insurance company does not need to be contacted. You just get diagnosed and then treated / prescribed, just like that. Even a nation as grumpy as Britain is generally happy with waiting list times.

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I don't see how healthcare is a right. I don't understand how you can have a right to somebody else's services. If a doctor refuses to treat you, that's their choice. You're essentially wanting to force them to treat you, which is the equivalent of enslavement. Nobody has the right to somebody else's services.

It isn't "somebody else's" services. It is your service. The NHS is MY service, and automatically the service of other English citizens also :). If you refuse to do your job, you get fired. If you don't want to help / treat people, don't be a doctor. In the NHS as a doctor your job is to treat people, and you are paid by the NHS, by taxpayers, the people whose back you have covered in case they get sick or injured. How is this slavery?

I don't know why you seem reluctant to acknowledge problems in America's healthcare system. Perhaps because you're too young, and have little/no experience. I'm happy for your government for trying to fix your terrible problem, not without you, but in spite of you :)

What is your issue with social medicine? I really can't get my head around how you could take such an arrogant stance on it. Fuck the policeman who guards you and your property? And the fireman who will protect your house from fire? And the soldiers out there who are (supposedly) protecting your country? Your country is so backwards that private fire insurance actually existed. The firemen would come, and if you didn't have a plan with their group, you were fucked. Watch your house burn down (unless it was adjacent to somebody's who was with them).

Would you prefer a tax system where you could pick and choose what your tax money is spent on? Your country would crumble to the ground. Your false war would instantly collapse. The supreme irony of those demanding the "right" to not have their tax money go to women's health (primarily abortion) yet who still want everyone to pay for their bullshit war is just astounding.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 04:37:58 AM by Roph »
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LOOOOOOOOOL

straight from my friend's facebook. Mostly my roomates and a brother are commenting, but then there's that one guy, who just keeps going and going.
Jason Katz won that argument. Everybody else involved was retarded.

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I guess I'd have to read it to know lol. I read like the first 5 or 6 replies and they got progressively longer and longer so I stopped. Figured it was relevant to this, so I posted it =o

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Basically it's just this Jason fellow making logical arguments, and the rest resorting to ad hominem arguments.

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Oh, I forgot to post this sooner.


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Mawbeast
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I don't see how healthcare is a right. I don't understand how you can have a right to somebody else's services. If a doctor refuses to treat you, that's their choice. You're essentially wanting to force them to treat you, which is the equivalent of enslavement. Nobody has the right to somebody else's services.

since when was that part of this discussion?

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Alan Grayson and the new object of Irock's desires have a short back and forth.
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