Westboro Baptist Church (Gay Hate Banner welding Nutters)

More of a Rant than a Debate

I watched the louis theroux show on BBC 2 last night and found the religion to be full of holes:




They said they back God 100%... If he makes some one die of Cancer, if he knocks down the twin towers... It all happens down to us being sinners...So what about when God creates some one who is gay... or feel they are trapped in the wrong sex body...?

If they are so trusting that God is all was 100% right and God creates all then how can they explain away God Creating a Gay person...?

The Bible can be looked at any way you want, you could almost make a religion based on any thing being evil from it... It's not an intelligent read, and for people to base so much of their life on it to the point that they pickett at a funeral is just sick.

Funeral's are for people letting go of a loved one... It's a time that the soul is supposed to cross over, their bodies buried in Holy Ground blessed by the church it's self... For the Westboro worshipers to be saying the dead are burning in hell is WRONG...

I think the way they are carrying on and bad mouthing those giving their lives to try and make a difference to the world is SICK...

It's a Shame really... the eldest daughter (21) seemed pretty smart and fairly good looking.  I don't know why they would want to appear on TV inciting so much predijuice towards their fellow American's even if they are Gay... And to being doing it and preaching that is God's words is so wrong... The Bible was written by Jesus's followers, not God himself... Jesus was no more than a profit at best.

Why would God bother with words... if he hated Gay people he would strike them down himself... and if the Westboro Church is right then God will judge them any way... Whats 70 or 80 years when you imortal... a Human life time is a blink of an eye to a God... Why bother making such a song and dance about it...

Westboro Baptist Church should just mind their own bussiness... If they hate Gay's so much they shoudl pickett at Gay clubs and Gay perades and so fourth... NOT AT FUNERALS or other churches grounds... For them to pickett other churches makes them blasthemers also.

What's your thaughts on the whole Gays will burn in hell and this church as a whole ?

God hasn't stricken down anyone in a long time, I called him on it, and he didn't even smite me a little.

Well I can give you an answer to the why part; God creates homosexual desires as a test 


Personally I don't see a difference between churches like this (hell, even Christianity in a whole) as being any different then the Ku Klux Klan. Really, one inspires hatred of ethnics, the other homosexuals. Christians who don't tolerate and accept the KKK? Hypocritical.

I feel that these groups are bringing down society and twisting the idea of an accepting morality. I know first hand how these cults (any, hate inspiring religion)  can twist a persons logic to accept anything. Christians, and other similar groups, may say they don't hate gays, and perhaps even like some, but I can promise that the majority feel they deserve to burn in hell for eternity, because it's a "choice".

It's things like this as to why I'm so apposed to religion, it's also why I wont tolerate it (as in I'm going to tell people off who preach anti-tolerance about gays).

Well I can give you an answer to the why part; God creates homosexual desires as a test

I guess that would be the answer I would get from a Westboro Baptist, but why would God be so Evil to condem a creation of his own to Hell from the word go...?

Westboro see God as America's Terrorist and he striked down the twin towers... Killing all those people.

In my Eye's Murder is far worst than being Gay... And that's what the attack on the Twin Towers was it was mass murder and to attribute that act to God (If there is such a devine entery) is being foolish... If that's what they truely follow that would make Bin Larden a tool of God, or God's right hand man... But they have Gay people in Iraq too.

I am not keen on the activities of the Gay community and I veiw it with a slight standoffish approach, I have a Lesbian relative and two of my friends are Gay and have stong relationships with the same sex, I don't approve or disaprove, I don't care it's not for me to say what's right and what's wrong.

When the bible was written we knew nothing of the human brain or the chemicals envolved in what makes us fancey the oppersite sex or the same sex... It's becoming for more apparent that the chemical make up of some carries more charteristics of the oppersite sex... So a Male harbouring a fair amount of female genes... There's is only one chromosone that seperates us...

For the Daughters of the Westboro church to be denying them selves a relationship that may continue their blood line is going against nature as much as Gay's are going against the bible...

I hate the way the Bible messes with people's lives... Say if every one joined Westboro, and we did out all the Gays, and all the women has no intrest in men or desier to carry or procreate, the human race would end.

And say if again their faith is correct and we are all going to burn in Hell... If Heaven and Hell ever came to have a War, Hell's Army would kick arse against Heavens puney force.

There has to be an equal balance, almost every other religion preaches this...

(Being Arl aint too bad my Rep Keeps going up now)

I guess that would be the answer I would get from a Westboro Baptist, but why would God be so Evil to condem a creation of his own to Hell from the word go...?

Because this is a god created by man, in the image of man.

Westboro see God as America's Terrorist and he striked down the twin towers... Killing all those people.

In my Eye's Murder is far worst than being Gay... And that's what the attack on the Twin Towers was it was mass murder and to attribute that act to God (If there is such a devine entery) is being foolish... If that's what they truely follow that would make Bin Larden a tool of God, or God's right hand man... But they have Gay people in Iraq too.

Why discuss "why"? Religion has a strong influence over people, from my point of view, I can ask "why" anyone would believe in any of the man-made religions in today's world, but I don't, as there is no need. People believe this because they have been raised in this light, and have been subjected to propaganda all their lives.

We should really be discussing whether it's acceptable for a group of people, to be teaching others to hate homosexuals, not why they feel that way.

When the bible was written we knew nothing of the human brain or the chemicals envolved in what makes us fancey the oppersite sex or the same sex... It's becoming for more apparent that the chemical make up of some carries more charteristics of the oppersite sex... So a Male harbouring a fair amount of female genes... There's is only one chromosone that seperates us...

Brainwashing/stupidity, doesn't really matter what we "know" now, nothing has more salesmanship then religion.

I hate the way the Bible messes with people's lives... Say if every one joined Westboro, and we did out all the Gays, and all the women has no intrest in men or desier to carry or procreate, the human race would end.

1) The majority of Christian groups (they are a Christian denomination right?) teach negative attitudes against gays. 2) LOL, their women don't have sex?? I'm going to have to check in on what they teach...

And say if again their faith is correct and we are all going to burn in Hell... If Heaven and Hell ever came to have a War, Hell's Army would kick arse against Heavens puney force.

What?

There has to be an equal balance, almost every other religion preaches this...

Equal balance of what? And why would they have to? I don't remember any religion wielding the flag of rationality.

Equal balance of what? And why would they have to? I don't remember any religion wielding the flag of rationality.

Budisium and others like Tao... An Equal Balance of good and Evil... Ying and Yang...

If the Westboro Baptist members are the only ones to reach heaven then God's Army is only going to have a few angles... But Hell's will have many a Demon.

I don't know enough about the Bible to be Quoting it... Heaven Vs Hell and them being equally as strong else one would over throw the other... Light and Darkness all that bollox and mumbo jumbo.

I am LOS by the way (Some stupid Arl april fools thing has replaced all Ava's and stuff... Not funny just lame)... And pretty much every member on here knows I dislike the Bible.

We should really be discussing whether it's acceptable for a group of people, to be teaching others to hate homosexuals, not why they feel that way.

Good Call "Arl"...

The show I watched last night showed kids about 5 years old holding the banners and signs, GOD HATES FAG TROOPS and louis theroux asked the child what the sign ment the kid had no idea...

Some one drove past in a car and chucked a Slush Puppy like drink and it struck one of the kids in the face... the liquid could have so easyily been acid... He was only About 8 and Ginger, he can't help being Ginger as much as a Gay person can help being Gay...

I don't think marching your Kids about the streets holding banners and signs that they don't understand leaving them open for attack is a good idea in the slightest.

The Children have no friends outside of the church and don't want friends outside the church... they don't see the point as they wont see them in the after life... TWISTED !!!

Just sent them a Message:-

Hello,

I know it's wrong to go against nature and to have a same sex relationship...
(I wouldn't say God as far as I am aware God didn't write the bible and Jesus didn't write any chapters either)...

But watching the program and seeing how the Girls are sort of restricted in taking up a relationship is also kind of against nature... I know some people that give them selves to God and his preachings stay celebut, but Jesus had a child and went to France with his child and other half, they celebrate his coming to the shores yearly.

The Bibile (What I have read of it) can be looked at in what ever way you see fit... (I was given a New Testiment when I was 12).

I see Jesus as a Profit, not the Son of God... I have many reasons for not following a religion, I know your church isn't about gaining members, it's about showing the world as a pretty pervus place...

I kind of agree with you, priests are now giving unions between same sex couples yet just a few years ago most churches had the same mind set as your own... Are they just being Weak to try and up their numbers... I think so... So in that respect I think it's good you have held your faith true to the bible.

The Bible keeps getting re-written to suite the times, and looses some thing every time that happens, one of the many reasons I have no taken up the same faith as many English born and bread... I do respect your ideals, but they way your going about it and picketting at Funerals of dead soilders is very off... The soilders are being put to rest in holy ground (Yes, may be blessed by a faulse profit in your eye's)...

How could those soilders be put to rest in without you picketting, what would they need to do ?... I mean can the moarners repent, or approach your church requesting you not to be there ?...

I know you would not want those sort of signs appearing at funerals of your loved ones, for what ever reason... It did shake me slightly to see how devoted even the youngest of your members are and how they have been drafted in to hold signs they barely understand...

You all seem like very nice people in the show I watched, your eldest daughter of 21 came across very well... May be the only one saving grace your church had in the show, and the fact you have a VERY string religious centre that wont be changed.

It's not the American people fault they are blind to the points you are making... if any ones it's the goverment it's self... After all Bush claims God told him to go to war... The soilders that have gone to Iraq may have been in the Army long before the War even started, wrong place at the wrong time... And many see the War to be pointless and may even have simular views as your own... I don't think their place of rest is fair to be picketted...

You should take your work to places like Gay Bars, the White house, May be at a push Army recruitment centres... But a Church giving a ceramony to a loved one trying to send the sould of that person onto the next life is kind of disrespecting all other versions of the faith...

Their are many branches of Christianity, and some I think are much stranger than your own... Like the talking in tounges rubbish and so fourth appearing all over the USA... At least you are reading the Gospel and not trying to converse with God... if any one is mental it's those people over you...

And I think you are far from being the worst family in the USA... You don't deal drug's you don't go shooting people... your not hurting any one pysically only mentally...

When I say that I think your teaching the younger children to be predijuice... Gay people can't help being Gay, just as much as a Ginger person can help being Ginger...

If God is 100% right all the time, then he has to be right when he created a Gay or Ginger person...

I don't know enough about the Bible or what the word of God should be, I hope I have not offended you in any way with my Nieve approach... I have no religion or faith... I have no argueement with Gay people, I am not offended by them neither do I approve of their activity... I am impartial to both sides, religion and sexual orentaion to me are very little factors in our time on this planet, side lines... they don't make us who we are, we should never label ourselves as some thing... You are you, and blaming some thing for your actions is always wrong in my eye's... we are all responicple for what we say or do.

I found your view's interesting... I don't see why some many are up in arms about it... most of the modren world would have been out there with you 50 years ago... It's odd how the words in the Gospel have been altered in the last few years...

And the world is a Pervurse place... You know the Muslim and Hindu Faith's have very little time for Gay's and still outcast them to a degree, and their faith's stem back much further than that of the Bible... They have some great Gods and good theories in Demons...

I have looked at many religion's trying to find one I like... But I have yet to have found it... I would not join yours, but I wish it all the best... But most poeple in the USA are brainwashed by the flag, Bush and the leaders of the churches who back same sex relationships...

Your fighting a loosing battle... But in a country so fond of Democricy I don't see why they wont at least give you the time of day for your opions... I mean the air this Crud:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRwoAZgQf6c

Just so you know there is a least one person who doesn't hate you or think your the Worst family ever... I don't agree with you, but I am not religious and don't agree 100% with any religion... (I respect your holding of the original Gospel, and you not bending on Benders)... Not that I agree with that, I don't hate Gay people at all.

But that aside... Please cut back on the picketting of Funeral's... I know if you appeared at one of my loved ones with those signs I would be greatly saddend... No one in my family are Gay, I have friends that are... Some Gay people are the nicest people I know... Get to know them, try approaching them and try and understand them, heck try baptising them see if you can "cure" them... If it's the Devils work surely if you are blessed by God you can do some thing... (I doubt it, as God I think has no Power on changing the minds of people)

I think if God was that angry with them he would have blown away gay bars with lightning bolts by now... Or made some sort of Virus much worse than aids that lived in the backpassage...

Any way I think I have wrote enough.

Thanks for your time

Steve

Who can define what's gay and what's straight, if I make out with a guy that I find attractive, does that make me gay?
There are guys I consider attractive, and there are guys I think look extremely ugly, and the same goes for women, some women are attractive, others are not.
Does that make everyone who finds some women unattractive, gay too?

It's a rather thin line.

What's your thaughts on the whole Gays will burn in hell and this church as a whole ?

All churches are an affront to christianty.

Equal balance of what? And why would they have to? I don't remember any religion wielding the flag of rationality.

Or maybe you just don't feel like seeing the rationality in the religions because it differs from your personal view of what is and isn't rational.

To you science and logic may be the pinnacle of human understanding, but that's your worldview and like everything else in the world it's relative.

Budisium and others like Tao... An Equal Balance of good and Evil... Ying and Yang...

Yin and Yang don't represent good and evil, the concepts of good and evil are definite and Yin and Yang are like the Ouroboros, they transcend into eachother as they reach their full. (This is symbolized by the white dot in the Yin and the black dot in the Yang.)


Besides, most religions practice acceptance, theres no need to bother with other people, if they want to be gay, let them, it's not your problem.

Do not judge upon that you may not be judged. For with what judgement you judge, you shall be judged.

Yay for google.

Just sent them a Message:-

Post up the response if you get one.

Who can define what's gay and what's straight, if I make out with a guy that I find attractive, does that make me gay?
There are guys I consider attractive, and there are guys I think look extremely ugly, and the same goes for women, some women are attractive, others are not.
Does that make everyone who finds some women unattractive, gay too?

It's a rather thin line.

Lol, yeah, your gay.

Or maybe you just don't feel like seeing the rationality in the religions because it differs from your personal view of what is and isn't rational.

Yer, that's almost the definition of what an opinion is.

To you science and logic may be the pinnacle of human understanding, but that's your worldview and like everything else in the world it's relative.

>_>, uh yeah, I do think logic to be some what swell, I can see you don't... As to the science part... You do understand it's not a preset thing..? Science is constantly changing, and correcting itself, quite sad religion isn't.

Do not judge upon that you may not be judged. For with what judgement you judge, you shall be judged.

Yay for google.

Wtf is quoting a single bible passage going to do? I also remember something about cleansing them with fire. Seems they doth not know how to not contradict thyself!

Do not judge upon that you may not be judged. For with what judgement you judge, you shall be judged.

That is probably the most retarded translation of that passage I have ever heard. Regardless, that is pretty much the way most of the mainstream Christian religions approach the subject. This mainly translates into "hate the sin, not the sinner." which suffers from bad phrasing, but is what is taught.

I am not exactly sure what the offense is here. What is it that the family did? It sounds like you are saying they picketed a funeral, but whose funeral? The title suggests a gay man's, but I thought I read something about it being a soldier's or something ... I also have no idea what this means:

Say if every one joined Westboro, and we did out all the Gays, and all the women has no intrest in men or desier to carry or procreate, the human race would end.

I am fairly certain that if the women had no desire to procreate, the human race would end regardless if we all joined Westboro. Maybe some clarification?

Anyway, yeah, I think picketing a funeral is bad, and hatred based on sexuality is bad too (well, all hatred is bad). However, I also think that it is unlikely that whatever authority is behind the Baptist Church would approve of these actions, and so I think it is unfair to generalize it and blame it on the baptists. That being said, I do not know specifically what Baptists believe in this respect and so I suppose it is possible and in that case I will say that what they are doing is bad. I do think it unlikely though, unless they decided to ignore the New Testament, which is unlikely.


Kind of off-topic:

Spoiler for:

Wtf is quoting a single bible passage going to do? I also remember something about cleansing them with fire. Seems they doth not know how to not contradict thyself!

As much as the phrasing made me laugh, it is not a very effective argument. Most Christians believe that the coming of Jesus changed the way in which God interacts with humanity. In most of Christianity, the Old Testament's laws, particularly it's punishments, do not carry over past the time of Jesus. Evidence for this is found throughout the New Testament - this is not an isolated passage. Jesus even revises the ten commandments into two. I do not know what you intend to accomplish by attacking beliefs that nobody holds. The Old Testament is taken seriously by Christians as an account of humanity's relationship with God, but the laws were revised with the coming of Jesus. In particular, forgiveness of sins. Even though the things condemned in the Old Testament are still considered to be sins, neither punishment nor hatred are advocated. That can be seen pretty much everywhere in the New Testament, and Christianity is, not surprisingly, based on Christ. If you are going to try to attack Christianity, you have to attack the words and actions of Christ, not the Old Testament.

>_>, uh yeah, I do think logic to be some what swell, I can see you don't...

I find logic to be of little use since it doesn't apply to humanity, we do things just because we can, completely independant from logic and rationality.
It's the source of alot of fucked up things, but also of the greatest things in life derive from our creativity.

Elegy

Who can define what's gay and what's straight, if I make out with a guy that I find attractive, does that make me gay?
There are guys I consider attractive, and there are guys I think look extremely ugly, and the same goes for women, some women are attractive, others are not.
Does that make everyone who finds some women unattractive, gay too?

I would say your young and still trying to find out who you are... or your Bi-Sexual.

modern algebra
Try Wikki on Westboro Baptist Church or U-Tube even... I mean the mosted hated family in the USA (According to BBC 2), the Phelp's...

Here go just encase you can't be asked:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church

And here is a link to all the You Tube video's:- http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Westboro+Baptist+Church&search=Search

No Reply as yet from them...

YING and YANG (Wikki Quote)

Yin is often symbolized by water or earth, while yang is symbolized by fire or wind.

Yin (the receptive, feminine, dark, passive force) and yang (the creative, masculine, bright, active force) are descriptions of complementary opposites rather than absolutes. Any yin/yang dichotomy can be viewed from another perspective. All forces in nature can be seen as having yin and yang states, and the two are in movement rather than held in absolute stasis.

In Western culture, the dichotomy of good and evil is often taken as a paradigm for other dichotomies. In Hegelian dialectics, dichotomies are linked to progress. In Chinese philosophy, the paradigmatic dichotomy of yin and yang does not generally give preference or moral superiority to one side of the dichotomy, and dichotomies are linked to cyclical processes rather than progress. Excessive yin or yang state is often viewed to be undesirable[citation needed]; however, Taoism often values yin above yang [1], and Confucianism often values yang above yin.

Gayness is not a sin because there is no such thing as sin. A god is what people make it, and most often its attributes are those of the men and women who create it. These people think their god hates gays because they hate gays.

I like this guy =) (contains alot of swearing)

www.godhatesfags.com

WTF

Yeah, I know about these guys... They also say that "the soldiers support the fags" They came to a soldier's funeral that was near where I live and were protesting. There was a group of old men who called our county sheriff and asked if they could sit across the road with thier guns. The sheriff said that they could but they would be arrested for not having a permit to be on that property. He said nothing about the guns... Note: I live in Arkansas.

It's strange that LoS is against Westboro but uses their terminology to refer to gays in this thread's title ("fags").

Okay, well these guys are just total lunatics. Is there anybody they don't hate? So far, by my count, it's Muslims, Mormons, Homosexuals, Jews, Catholics, America, Canada. Hell, they probably even hate Baptists. These guys are just retarded.

Saladin

It's strange that LoS is against Westboro but uses their terminology to refer to gays in this thread's title ("fags").

That's cuz their site is called:- www.godhatesfags.com

Posted by: modern algebra
Okay, well these guys are just total lunatics. Is there anybody they don't hate? So far, by my count, it's Muslims, Mormons, Homosexuals, Jews, Catholics, America, Canada. Hell, they probably even hate Baptists. These guys are just retarded.

LOL... They are bonkers.

Saladin

It's strange that LoS is against Westboro but uses their terminology to refer to gays in this thread's title ("fags").

That's cuz their site is called:- www.godhatesfags.com

And if was called www.godhatesniggers.com would you put "nigger haters" in the title?

Yes... What's the point your trying to make ?

They hate Gays and reffer to them as Fag's... I am not calling Gay people Fags... I am using their terminology, as the thread started off as a Rant about them... And not many people know them as the Westboro Baptist Church, but if I say the Fag hater with refference to the church pretty much any one who watches the news will know who I mean.

Saladin if your not joining in with the debate, please go do some thing different... But just for you I have made the title a little more descriptive for you... and changed the word Fag to Gay.

Added the documentary to the first post, check it out:

http://rmrk.net/index.php/topic,14753.msg187489.html#msg187489

Who cares what other people do, or if everyone became homosexual? Humans suck anyways. Might as well do whatever you want to do, so long as it isn't hurting other people.

I am not calling Gay people Fags...

Actually, it kind of implied you where...

Saladin if your not joining in with the debate, please go do some thing different... But just for you I have made the title a little more descriptive for you... and changed the word Fag to Gay.

I was going to mention it myself, but eh...

If everyone becomes homo-sexual, where would all the babies go?  That may lead to the end of the world 

Did you even read that before you posted it?? Seriously, WTF.

First; I don't see how a few people being gay is going to turn the entire world queer, perhaps YOU can be sold into that position quite easily, but I guarantee most wouldn't be persuaded into homosexuality, unless it was already a dormant factor of their lives.

Second; Going by your obvious lack of knowledge that we're in the year 2oo7, we have something called artificial insemination and in vitro fertilisation. If we all turned gay, the world would continue to produce babies quite fine.

Third; THINK before you post, and remember, there is no way, at all, to justify being anti-homosexual. Please, feel free to continue posting, as this is a forum of free thinking and non-predigest, but I'm going to post right back.

Just saw the video and read what Louis actually thinks of the family on BBC 2. Overall I think it's rather sad.