Aren't I just thought I would make it apparent to people, because I can't let it be set aside any longer. In this last two months there have been a chain of 4 columbine replicated incidents. Today a 13 year old KID brought an AK47 to his middle school, though due to his inexperience of guns it jammed. Though I've been seeing these incidents alot more than I care to see, and I'm starting to worry about myself, *being a student myself*, as well as others nationwide. I just want to get some insight into what everyone thinks about these incidents, because I think that once was way more than enough and if people don't see the problem then we only shall promote incidents as several of us have seen.
This is somewhat disturbing. Parents need to take a more proactive role against such behavior. And NO, I don't mean blame the television, (which, so you know, is NOT a fucking babysitter) or take the easy out and blame videogames. (Because guess what, YOU BOUGHT 'EM.) I mean get off of your ass, pay attention to how your child feels and raise your kids the old fashioned way.
That's right, with a belt.
I am not opposed to this method. Simple cause and effect, with a bit of symbolism.
This May Offend Some People
Well, games are alright as long as they have some beneficial meaning behind them, but games like
"Grand Theft Auto" only promote such actions. Also who said it was the parent's fault? We have a concious don't we? We want more liberty to do our own actions, but when kids mess up why do they blame it on their parents? True their parents play a big role, and parents that permit kids to be in gangs or ignore the facts of negative changes in a kids life SHOULD be criticized, but the kid who is the one who committed it should be held at 1st in the punishment list. Also if parents are so insecure to have a gun in the house, make sure it's unloaded, and remove the trigger. If a parent won't take that simple step, then kids will continue to be retards because they can dodge the blame, and start killing people without getting shunned upon. Parents that drink should STOP because if they have enough time to drink then they have enough time to pay attention to a kid which is 1st priority, and parents that can't commit to such a role shouldn't be parents NOR should be around kids.
Quote from: Naphe on October 10, 2006, 01:43:43 AM
This May Offend Some People
Well, games are alright as long as they have some beneficial meaning behind them, but games like "Grand Theft Auto" only promote such actions. Also who said it was the parent's fault? We have a concious don't we? We want more liberty to do our own actions, but when kids mess up why do they blame it on their parents? True their parents play a big role, and parents that permit kids to be in gangs or ignore the facts of negative changes in a kids life SHOULD be criticized, but the kid who is the one who committed it should be held at 1st in the punishment list. Also if parents are so insecure to have a gun in the house, make sure it's unloaded, and remove the trigger. If a parent won't take that simple step, then kids will continue to be retards because they can dodge the blame, and start killing people without getting shunned upon. Parents that drink should STOP because if they have enough time to drink then they have enough time to pay attention to a kid which is 1st priority, and parents that can't commit to such a role shouldn't be parents NOR should be around kids.
Quite true, HOWEVER....
Violent games do not affect people as people say, if a kid DOES start copying what he/she sees, then that kid had a problem before getting the game.
Exactly, it just means the kid has a problem differentiating(sp?) reality and fantasy. It's a medical condition I like to call - "Wake up Moron, This is the Real World".
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 01:50:19 AM
Quote from: Naphe on October 10, 2006, 01:43:43 AM
This May Offend Some People
Well, games are alright as long as they have some beneficial meaning behind them, but games like "Grand Theft Auto" only promote such actions. Also who said it was the parent's fault? We have a concious don't we? We want more liberty to do our own actions, but when kids mess up why do they blame it on their parents? True their parents play a big role, and parents that permit kids to be in gangs or ignore the facts of negative changes in a kids life SHOULD be criticized, but the kid who is the one who committed it should be held at 1st in the punishment list. Also if parents are so insecure to have a gun in the house, make sure it's unloaded, and remove the trigger. If a parent won't take that simple step, then kids will continue to be retards because they can dodge the blame, and start killing people without getting shunned upon. Parents that drink should STOP because if they have enough time to drink then they have enough time to pay attention to a kid which is 1st priority, and parents that can't commit to such a role shouldn't be parents NOR should be around kids.
Quite true, HOWEVER....
Violent games do not affect people as people say, if a kid DOES start copying hear he/she sees, then that kid had a problem before getting the game.
Ahh, but how does a kid get the idea of violence and other negative ideas presented in GTA if they've never been presented to them before. For example, how would you get the idea of cells if you've never seen them before?
That is not what I'm talking about, what the kid copies does not matter, it's the fact he's copying ANYTHING he see. Wheather it's good or bad.
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 01:57:13 AM
Quote from: Naphe on October 10, 2006, 01:54:02 AM
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 01:50:19 AM
Quote from: Naphe on October 10, 2006, 01:43:43 AM
This May Offend Some People
Well, games are alright as long as they have some beneficial meaning behind them, but games like "Grand Theft Auto" only promote such actions. Also who said it was the parent's fault? We have a concious don't we? We want more liberty to do our own actions, but when kids mess up why do they blame it on their parents? True their parents play a big role, and parents that permit kids to be in gangs or ignore the facts of negative changes in a kids life SHOULD be criticized, but the kid who is the one who committed it should be held at 1st in the punishment list. Also if parents are so insecure to have a gun in the house, make sure it's unloaded, and remove the trigger. If a parent won't take that simple step, then kids will continue to be retards because they can dodge the blame, and start killing people without getting shunned upon. Parents that drink should STOP because if they have enough time to drink then they have enough time to pay attention to a kid which is 1st priority, and parents that can't commit to such a role shouldn't be parents NOR should be around kids.
Quite true, HOWEVER....
Violent games do not affect people as people say, if a kid DOES start copying hear he/she sees, then that kid had a problem before getting the game.
Ahh, but how does a kid get the idea of violence and other negative ideas presented in GTA if they've never been presented to them before. For example, how would you get the idea of cells if you've never seen them before?
That is not what I'm talking about, what the kid copies does not matter, it's the fact he's copying ANYTHING he see. Wheather it's good or bad.
People follow trends, your a victim of it to. So does that mean you have something wrong with you? People also dress like their favorite characters from games, "For Some Reason I Do Not Know", or a good anime. So do these people have problems to? The answer is no, according to majority opinion, and I agree only because it's another way for people to vent the pressures of the world so they don't overheat.
That kind of exmaple can vary, if you are somewhat in touch with trends and you are not obsessed with them, no you don't have a problem. But....
If you are always on beat with trends and you lose sleep and get grey hairs over them, you do have a problem.
About the dressing up as a characters, almost the same thing. If you dress up once in a while, like for Halloween, you don't have a problem.
But if you wear your Spiderman costume everywhere and seem to lose your socal life, you may have a problem.
This is intelligent debate guys, not the quote pyramid.
^ We'll lose it.
I understand what you were trying to say originally about not being able to distinguish between fiction/reality, but it was worded kind of funny, kind of skewed you point.
As for the costume comment, that is neither here nor there, as those individuals are fully aware that they are dressing up LIKE the characters, rather than transforming into them.
But what if you think you are them, thus transforming into them?
Quote from: Tsunokiette on October 10, 2006, 02:24:55 AM
But what if you think you are them, thus transforming into them?
Simple. You have a problem.
Regarding the video game influence thing; I remember seeing a study done that showed the decrease in crime rate since video games of the said type were introduced... But however, the matter was affected by sources from all sides so the accuracy of the direct correlation is not clear. Perhaps without the video games, the crime rates would decrease even further. Who knows.
...Which just proved the pointlessness of the above paragraph. :'(
Well I just want to point out something a slightly off-topic as comfort. One of the reasons that these incidents are seemingly becoming more of a threat is the power of advanced media technology now days. Back in the days, even if things happened, people would be oblivious to them since there was no such convinient ways for info to leak to them; and hence the existence of such matters would be seen as non-existent. So perhaps these threats are growing, or perhaps that the only change is the media is over-shining the incidents. Who knows.
...Which just proved the pointlessness of the above paragraph again. :'( I'm tired.
It seems only Tsunokiette and Reives hit close...
Anyway Reives it is the fault of the media, because do we really want to know all the people that are getting killed? If it's a major thing yes, but every single person, no....The news also makes the killers infamous and that is what most common teens want now-a-days regardless of the terms of getting it.
Quote from: Naphe on October 10, 2006, 02:46:57 AM
It seems only Tsunokiette and Reives hit close...
Anyway Reives it is the fault of the media, because do we really want to know all the people that are getting killed? If it's a major thing yes, but every single person, no....The news also makes the killers infamous and that is what most common teens want now-a-days regardless of the terms of getting it.
But, you can't blame the media, because you as a person can chose what you learn and don't learn.
If I don't want to learn math, then I don't learn math.
If I want to learn how to kill, then I learn how to kill.
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 02:54:33 AM
But, you can't blame the media,
Heheh, that might be the first time I've heard that in a long time.
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 02:54:33 AM
because you as a person can chose what you learn and don't learn.
Now, is that true...?
Quote from: Reives on October 10, 2006, 02:59:59 AM
Now, is that true...?
Yes, look at racists, no matter how much you debate, they chose not to learn the lesson that "People are equal"
Quote from: Land of Vita on October 10, 2006, 03:02:18 AM
Quote from: Reives on October 10, 2006, 02:59:59 AM
Now, is that true...?
Yes, look at racists, no matter how much you debate, they chose not to learn the lesson that "People are equal"
What I'm saying is, do you think one has absolute control to his actions? Why did the racist become racist in the first place?
Could it perhaps be the exposure of the opinions about the subject that shaped their view?
Returning to the parent issue and connecting the two -
If you are a racist, it's most likely because your parents are racists, and that's how you grew up, if not it's probably because your friends think it's cool, and you end up being swallowed into the idea.
This would lead us into a discussion about the developmental window, which is a whole other story all together.
Quote from: Tsunokiette on October 10, 2006, 03:10:24 AM
Returning to the parent issue and connecting the two -
If you are a racist, it's most likely because your parents are racists, and that's how you grew up, if not it's probably because your friends think it's cool, and you end up being swallowed into the idea.
Yeah. So although it is up to one to make the decisions, one does not actually make it without outer influences that shapes greatly (if not entirely) from their surroundings.
Quote from: arrowone on October 10, 2006, 03:11:47 AM
This would lead us into a discussion about the developmental window, which is a whole other story all together.
Yay stories!
*cough*
On topic, I tend to get more creative in my thinking later at night, it's 11 pm here, I've got to wake up in 7 and a half hours, and am probably going to stay awake till my dad gets home.
I'm pretty much along till then and I don't want him to walk into the house all bloodied up while I'm upstairs snoozing.
Truely on topic - The whole violence issue has many different reasons for existing. You can't blame it on a single source *cough*Satan*cough*.
Quote from: Reives on October 10, 2006, 03:14:03 AM
Yeah. So although it is up to one to make the decisions, one does not actually make it without outer influences that shapes greatly (if not entirely) from their surroundings.
I see your point, I can't stand racism because it's how I was raised.
I get it.
Just to clarify I'm absolutely not supporting racism by that, just using it as an example~ :P
P.S. So Tsun, you sleep for like 6 hours a day? :o
Quote from: Tsunokiette on October 10, 2006, 03:20:18 AM
Truely on topic - The whole violence issue has many different reasons for existing. You can't blame it on a single source
I agree, which is why I don't like it when people think that the media makes people violent.
Yep, it's just one of the sources for the environmental shaping of one's views on things and etc.
Quote from: Reives on October 10, 2006, 03:24:08 AM
Just to clarify I'm absolutely not supporting racism by that, just using it as an example~ :P
P.S. So Tsun, you sleep for like 6 hours a day? :o
When I'm lucky. -_-
My eyes twitch all the time during class, and I end up making a fool of myself a lot in front of teh girlies. |=0P
ON TOPIC -
Yeah, it's seriously more than one thing *cough*Satan*cough*. So you can't blame it on video games, if you do you might as well ban them, and ban books and movies while you're at it. As a matter of fact, put your child in a bubble.
Quote from: Tsunokiette on October 10, 2006, 03:30:16 AM
When I'm lucky. -_-
My eyes twitch all the time during class, and I end up making a fool of myself a lot in front of teh girlies. |=0P
You're not in college yet if I remember right? If you're getting 6 hours of sleep per day in high school, be prepared to not sleep at all in college. ;)
On-Tpic:
Whoa whoa whoa, wait a minute; I just realized that I was apparently arguing that video games are an influence to violence... I'm actually against that idea, as I see it as a stress relief system that does no realistic direct damage literally. Although I guess you can argue both ways...
But people in general are different from one another, and the effect of everything are not singularly distributed into one row.
[OFF TOPIC]
Well, it's only cause my lazy arse stays up all night. I've got bad isomnia(sp?) crap, whatsit called? Anyways, the point is most of my family has it bad, so we get used to not sleeping at all, you should see the massive bags we build under our eyes lolz.
Ah well, I guess it means you live 2 hours longer a day than the average guy which = 730 hours a year =~ 30.42 days per year = a month = if lived till 75 years old, =~75 months which = 6 and a quarter years more. . .
...Holy )@*$ did I make a mistake in the calculation or something? I'm so boycotting sleep.
Anyway back to the topic. How does an elementary kid get his hands on an ILLEGAL AK47?
His father.
damm u
Actaully i think he mustve talked to some stranger and got in deals with him.
Kids these days, they suicide if they get below 70.
Me, i dun even cry if i fail(which i have not) cuz the percent doesnt matter till 12th around here..but in 10th and 12th u should get good..
CHILDREN...
Well considering that all the tests pre-college, and their overall beneficial standards rate has plummited while the college standards have stayed the same, has created a big gap thus creating more pressure for highschool students. Yet I can't concur why a little elementary kid would do something like that. Maybe our schooling standards have dropped so low that kids aren't even able to develop their comprehension between right and wrong...If that is true and I was a leader over serveral people, I would start a new country by purchasing land from Russia, near the sea boarder in the tundra region and create a similiar replication to the highly idolized idea of Utopia.
Utopia has it's price. If you don't let people think themselves, your Utopia actually is none. But if you do you've actually reached nothing. I think Utopia is impossible just because all the people are different and their opinions are different. Everybody's comprehension of right and good is different. That's the main problem.
Agreed with Blizzard. But I guess a solution to that would be to gather a group of like-minded individuals; however it would vastly limit its growth and expansion, which will most likely lead it to fall apart eventually.
An fantastic example of this would be Egypt under the rule of the Pharaoh.
Quote from: Blizzard on October 12, 2006, 04:45:24 PM
Utopia has it's price. If you don't let people think themselves, your Utopia actually is none. But if you do you've actually reached nothing. I think Utopia is impossible just because all the people are different and their opinions are different. Everybody's comprehension of right and good is different. That's the main problem.
It's possible, it's like saying white people can get in a relationship with black,tan, pink, etc. people, but hey look it's been done. Though it would take good leadership or self-determination to make that work. Because a good leader can bring inspiration to feul the fire of self-determination.